Re: [ Partly PING Trin ] Guilt and associated concepts

In article <slrndp09gl.c7.trap@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
Romauld <trap@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Recently, a script from Nuala arrived, in which they said:

> : Guilt is not an emotion but a combination of emotions, usually fear and
> : anger for some reasons and in different combinations.

> That's a perspective I hadn't really considered... I can see
> the utility of seeing it that way. I'm not totally sure I agree.

Ah. Let me be clearer: this isn't a seeing thing, but a feeling thing.

I find that whenever humans discuss emotions, there is a tendency to get
lost. ("No, this isn't anger, it's frustration, or maybe annoyance. And
that isn't fear, it's nerves or anxiety.") Unfortunately, when this
happens, I've observed that people lapse into a mild trance state while
they wrestle with the language, and so they slip back into the feeling.
And they do all this every time they try to get to grips with whatever
feeling is bothering them in a particular situation, so they self
hypnotise and reinforce the connection of memory to feeling.

In the meantime, while they are tranced out, however mildly, unscrupulous
personages can take advantage and drop pretty much whatever they like into
the mix. I have not yet ceased to be amazed at the amount of power I get
handed at these moments.

So, in order to simplify and thus *make* the language switch back to being
a useful tool, I suggest we work on the basis that there are only four
feelings, to whit: anger, fear, sadness and joy.[1]

Once a person knows where, physically, these emotions are felt, the
emotions become much more useful, just as they were meant to be.

When I hear someone say that they 'feel guilty', what I myself usually
feel as I sit and listen is actually fear, and sometimes anger. What this
means to the individual I couldn't say for sure, but I do know that anger
and fear are fight and flight from a perceived threat. And if someone is
sitting next to me in a quiet room, there is no real threat, so for
whatever reason, that person is rehearsing, repeating, and reinforcing the
perception of a threat concomitant with that memory.

The meaning becomes easier to unpick when the individual stops trancing
out, because the emotional hijack actually lowers their intelligence as
they regress back, sometimes to brain stem level. This is why people seem
to have an inner child: higher brain function is literally being switched
off as I watch, and they become childlike.

And many things are threatening to children which are not as important as
they mature, (parental/tribal/societal) approval being a rather obvious
example.


> : So I find the more interesting question in this thread to be:
> : From what are these defence mechanisms protecting us?

> Damn good question.

I thought so. <g>


[1] This is Transactional Analysis, in case anyone's interested. This is
an humanistic approach to counselling and so is a sister approach to my
own. It is also widely, and very successfully, used with organizations.


NP: Jet, Are You Gonna Be My Girl

~Love and blessings~

--
'My guilt chip is already on overdrive. I feel terrible. - Red Dwarf

~Phenobarbidoll~
'Occasionally I am callous and strange.'
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Evolution of Anger and Fear
    ... Those are ANGER and FEAR ... Take in nurturing ... lve to the emotions of ANGER and FEAR ...
    (sci.bio.evolution)
  • Re: Almost killed by a truck
    ... Your initial reaction was fear, ... Both fear and anger will arise almost instantaneously, ... While a head of righteous anger puffs up ... But after feeling it for a bit, ...
    (rec.bicycles.rides)
  • Re: Evolution of Anger and Fear
    ... How do emotions evolve? ... Those are ANGER and FEAR ... emotions of ANGER and FEAR ...
    (sci.bio.evolution)
  • Re: Evolution of Anger and Fear
    ... Are you suggesting that anger comes from lack of food? ... other important 'emotions' that could come from a lack of nutrients. ... Fear may come from the fear of being alone and having to forage alone, ... Note how the stress response of fight and flight fits option 2 and option= ...
    (sci.bio.evolution)
  • Re: Possible Basis of Fear and Anger
    ... If it's all centered around breast feeding, then reptiles should be ... incapable of these emotions. ... But as I understand it fear and anger are ...
    (sci.bio.evolution)