Re: Papal visit: Cardinal Newman's 'miracle cure'

On Tue, 14 Sep 2010 14:33:29 +0100, Michael J Davis
<mjdusenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

John R <truthseeker55@xxxxxxxxx> was inspired to say
On Tue, 14 Sep 2010 11:37:42 +0100, Michael J Davis
<mjdusenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Kendall Down <kkdown@xxxxxxxxxx> was inspired to say
On 13/09/2010 20:34, Alwyn wrote:

Something obviously happened to this man. Was it a miracle from God? You
judge!

As I understand it, he was claiming that it was a miracle from Newman,
not God.

No, Ken. However you may understand it, Newman was the intercessor, God
the source of healing.

Where does this stem from? My understanding was that there was only
one mediator between man and God, namely Jesus.

The Catholic (and Orthodox) answer is that the 'saints' i.e. (in this
context) in heaven can and will pray for us, just as I might pray for
you. They are, after all, more 'alive in Christ' than you or I.

true, unless you believe in soul sleep :-) I don't by the way.

But they are only able to do this because of Jesus' victory over sin and
death, Jesus is the mediator, we merely 'intercede' or 'stand in the
gap'.

Starting with Genesis 20:7, there are plenty of instructions for us to
pray for one another, of course. Try Matt 5:44, Lk 6:28, Acts 8:24, Eph
6:19, Col 1:3, James 5:16, Heb 13:18, as a cross section of examples of
requests for each other.

Of course Christians are to pray for each other. I have always
understood that to mean those still living though, nothing in the
texts quoted suggests those in Heaven praying for you. Can I ask a
question, how is it possible to communicate with them? If your friend
dies, are you able to say to him "Charlie, can you pray to God for
me"? If you ask someone who is now in Heaven to pray for you, how do
you know they have heard your request?


Rev 5:8 and 8:3 show that the prayers of the saints (and I agree that
includes the living) are effective in heaven,

You are assuming that includes people who are in Heaven, I don't (I
could be wrong) There are 215 references to saints in the Bible, I
have looked through quite a few, and they are all referring to those
still living.


and Rev 6:9-10 and also 1
Peter 3:19 & 4:6 shows that the dead (in the flesh) are able to respond
to God.

This is true, but says nothing about them being able to intercede for
those still living.


.

Relevant Pages

  • - Isaiah 41:10 -
    ... "I am your God!" ... Nine Day Novena to Saint Joseph, ... Patron of departing souls - Pray for me. ... Christ, have mercy on us. ...
    (alt.religion.christian)
  • Endtime Indications - 1/23/8
    ... "Pray for us. ... He prayed that God would keep his chosen believers safe from ... How are your prayers for others like and unlike Jesus' prayer? ... Experience Christian community in prayer. ...
    (alt.gathering.rainbow)
  • - Psalm 122:6-9 -
    ... Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: ... For the sake of the house of the LORD our God, ... martyred with members of their flock under the Persian King Shapur II, ... heavenly bodies or the elements without the Christians despising them. ...
    (alt.religion.christian)
  • Paul Harvey Says
    ... liberty or your pursuit of happiness will not be endangered because someone says a 30-second prayer before a football game. ... Our parents and grandparents taught us to pray before eating; to pray before we go to sleep. ... you don't have to pray; you don't have to say the pledge of allegiance; you don't have to believe in God or attend services that honor Him. ...
    (soc.retirement)
  • Re: The answer to all the worlds problems.
    ... The more and more deeply _you_ enter into Roman Catholicism, the closer ... The only thing stopping His Universal Reign is sin. ... But God could sort that in an instant yet he chooses not to. ... Pray very much. ...
    (alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic)