Re: Jade Goody

"Phil Saunders" <philip.saunders@xxxxxxxxxxxx> a écrit dans le message de
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"Phil Saunders" <philip.saunders@xxxxxxxxxxxx> a écrit dans le message de
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snip

Well, for the atheist I suppose there is always the alternative of
saying that they are going to hell.

But what atheist believes in hell?

All the dead ones.

So atheist 'saints' go to hell to? It has a strange concept of justice,
your belief system.

Everyone except the elect go to hell. By definition there aren't any
people of genuine faith in Jesus in Hell.

No justice then. Just salvation via capricious whim. How silly can a
belief system get.

How is it unjust to give a free pardon to some and to have all others
serve their sentence?

So let's get this straight. God creates sinful man, whereupon he seems to
randomly condemn some of those he caused to be sinful in the first place to
hell, while a certain number of 'elect' sinners are let off for no reason
other than God felt so inclined. No matter how virtuous a life is led on
Earth, a la Gandhi for example, that's just tough. What a nasty piece of
work such a God would be, then.

You say it's not random, that it's "God's choice" (PS), "for his pleasure"
(Calvin). The usual cop-out when there's no sensible alternative rebuttal.
God wills it, there it is by definition good - the perfect unbreakable
circular, if worthless, logic.

"It were most absurd to say, that he admits others fortuitously, or that
they by their industry acquire what election alone confers on a few. Those,
therefore, whom God passes by he reprobates, and that for no other cause but
because he is pleased to exclude them from the inheritance which he
predestines to his children." (Calvin)

Say that this suggests a rather unpleasant and capricious deity, and Calvin
replies:

"Who are ye, miserable men, that bring an accusation against God?" And: "We
shall gain nothing by proceeding farther".

In another thread you wrote:

"They do not go to Hell for doing what God predestined them to unwillingly.
They choose to do the things that result in destruction."

Please explain how you reconcile the Calvinist concept of predestination and
a chosen elect with the suggestion of freedom of choice you imply above. At
what point does the individual choose his fate, given that the people are
either born saved or unsaved?

If the sole purpose of the "unchosen", according to Calvin, is "to glorify
(God) by their destruction", then how can the unchosen choose?

What a strange idea "atheist saints".

" Atheist 'saints' " was the expression used. The meaning is clear.

Lol no it isnt. What do you mean by it?

See sub-thread which addressed this.




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