Re: "I am both Muslim and Christian" Rev Ann Holmes Redding

On 7 Feb, 13:11, Michael J Davis <?...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In message
<bb67b8de-5cf4-4b57-9daa-7c77e84cf...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
nobody <whena...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes





On 4 Feb, 16:28, Michael J Davis <?...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In message <slrnfq2iir.nad.Trevor.Jenk...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Trevor
Jenkins <Trevor.Jenk...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes

On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 11:35:25 -0800 (PST), nobody
<whena...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On 30 Jan, 08:01, "Kendall K. Down" <webmas...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
In message
<be97545e-1d8d-4b6a-b080-106220dbf...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
nobody <whena...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Its like taking the essays of 12 students, who understood very little
on the subject and making their essays the pinnacle of the subject.

Have you ever encountered Wikipedia?

Yes and people can change the text of Wikipedia webpages, they can
change the words, and delete entire paragraphs; in some ways the bible
and it are similar, just compare the KJV and NIV, entire verses have
been taken out of the NIV as compared to the KJV.

Me thinks you need to read the notes from the translators for the NIV. In
the four hundred or so years since the KJV was published earlier
manuscripts have been discovered. Those verses "taken out" are not present
in the earlier manucripts. Footnotes will provide you with the reasons
why; usually something along the lines of "earlier manuscripts do not have
this text".

[Repost from 15:52 31.01.2008]

I explained much of that in an earlier message - but he just keeps going
on about it. I also explained that what he is seeing is God's way of
keeping the message 'clean'.

God's way of keeping the message CLEAN?

1) By continuously changing it, by taking out complete verses.

Look the fact that we can compare early versions of the text of a very
small number of redactive glosses dating back from the earliest extant
copies, shows how well the text has been preserved.

I have elsewhere shown how those glosses - 'complete verses' are not
long nor do they change the meaning (mostly reflecting usage in the
parallel gospels) - are so few that they give us significant confidence
that the whole NT has not changed significantly, whichever route it has
come to us.


You say the text has been preserved and then you go onto say "the
whole NT has not changed significantly"

But yet it has been changed. The many changes between the KJV and NIV
have already been pointed out to you.

Once again where is the original bible... I am not talking about the
thousands of different manuscripts.


2) Keeping it CLEAN? We find in the bible stories of ADULTERY, INCEST,
RAPE, which end without one word of reproach; and you tell me these
verses were inspired by God.

The reporting of truth is always of God.

Do you think God has a thick carpet under which He brushes sin? No it is
exposed so that He can deal with it! Unless it is exposed, how can God
deal with it?

What...

This is ridiculous, you telling me these stories of adultery, rape and
incest (and the different types of incest that could be committed),
are included in the bible because god deals with it, these stories
finish without one word of reproach not one and nor do they start with
a single word of reproach for such actions; in other words you are
telling me the writer of the bible was inspired to write these stories
which in fact are stories of pornography by god, and god after telling
the man of such didn't tell him to write a single word of reproach
just a full stop at the end and start the next chapter. In your next
post would you consider telling me hugh hefner was inspired by God to
start his porn empire, because god deals with this sin.

When telling your daughter or your son not to commit such sins you
wont sit them down and read these stories of incest to them, or
provide them with a book of pornography and give them in effect a user
manual on how these sins could be committed in the end to tell them
this is how its done but you don't do this, you would rather just
quote the commandment to them, thou shalt not commit adultery, which
would be more than suffice to put the message across.


St Paul says:
Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but
rather expose them. For it is shameful even to mention what the
disobedient do in secret. But everything exposed by the light
becomes visible, for it is light that makes everything visible.
This is why it is said: "Wake up, O sleeper, rise from the dead,
and Christ will shine on you."
Eph 5:11-14

You see the Bible is (inter alia) the story of mankind's search for God,
and God's reaching out to mankind. By revealing sin and evil in human
nature we can understand that God loves everyone, in spite of their
wrongdoing, and is prepared to forgive them.

And that is why I will be eternally grateful that the punishment due for
my sin has been carried by Jesus on the cross.

[4:155-159] "That they rejected faith: that they uttered against Mary
a grave false charge. That they said (in boast) "We killed Christ
Jesus the son of Mary the Apostle of Allah"; but they killed him not
nor crucified him but so it was made to appear to them and those who
differ therein are full of doubts with no (certain) knowledge but only
conjecture to follow for of a surety they killed him not."
.

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