Re: Why do the Mormons bother with this newsgroup?

In news:Gc2of.9672$n95.3623@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx,
Phil Saunders gently whispered:
> "Paul Roberts" <p.t.roberts@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:dnq489$mda$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[snip]
>> Sadly, you now appear to have reverted to type. And the thing I find
>> most upsetting is that yours are not the actions of someone who is
>> so wound up that he posts in a fit of anger - which would be much
>> more understandable and excuseable.
>
> You mean I failed to turn the other cheek when Eric insulted me? Ah
> Do I recall your posts to Eric concerning his behaviour.

No, I don't. What is abundantly clear is that the discussions which become
heated usually have you as the common denominator. However much you want to
blame other people, that fact remains.

I didn't criticise Eric because he doesn't do it all the time - same with
Diana. Usually they are both amenable to friendly discussion.

>> No, your wording is careful, clever and very deliberate in order to
>> insult someone and make sure you stay within the charter. In this
>> post you are quite clearly accusing Eric of being childish. You
>> habitually do this; your hostility towards certain posters in
>> particular is quite painful.
>
> Of course I take care to stay within the charter. So do you. "You now
> appear to have reverted to type" for instance!!!! "your wording is
> careful, clever etc2 Instead of you are etc

Well, obviously. The purpose of my posting is to raise this issue with you -
I can't exactly do that without using such expressions, can I? But generally
such expressions are, or should be, completely unnecessary on ukrc, because
we should aim to attack the argument, not the poster.

>> Only yesterday you said to Diana:
>>
>> "Diana is it possible for you to post something that doesnt attempt
>> to malign me?"
>>
>> There is a word for this. Jesus used it a lot when speaking to the
>> Pharisees.
>
> And again.
>
> What was that word you were thinking of?

I think I made my point. I see no sense in labouring it.

>> The sad thing is that you are more than capable of putting together a
>> sensible argument without the ad hominem. But you should reflect that
>> people will take much more notice of you if you try to stay polite
>> and friendly.
>
> How about this, you do it and show me how. This post of yours shows
> that you do it. Eric does it to me. Diana does it to me.

I try not to. I prefer to address the arguments people make without
insulting them. If I fail to do this, I will be happy for someone to point
it out to me. But I'm afraid, Phil, that your constant sarcasm and vitriol
just gets me down, hence my objection.

[snip]
> Your maligning of me in careful, clever and deliberate way has shown
> me how much better you are at being what you accuse me of being.

I haven't maligned you, Phil - I've complained about your behaviour. I don't
make a habit of it; in fact, I feel pretty bad about doing it. I don't like
criticising anyone, especially in public. I've been on the point of doing
this on numerous occasions but I've held back. I genuinely thought recently
that you were trying to stop doing it, but now you're at it again.

It might just be me; it may be that I have a low tolerance level of this
type of behaviour. But it bugs me for two reasons:

(1) I can't understand why you feel the need to do it. Why are you so angry?
What do you think it achieves?

(2) Jesus tells us to love one another. I try, and usually fail, to do this,
but the thought that we can love one another by insulting and belittling
them is just so far off my radar that I am completely unable to get to grips
with it.

It's your choice, Phil. If you want to pretend that it's everyone else's
fault, go ahead and continue with what you're doing. If, on the other hand,
you want to try and improve the atmosphere, it's in your hands. You could
just try being friendly with the people you're at loggerheads with, and see
how they respond. What have you got to lose?
--
Paul R.
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