Re: Ice axe *or* crampons?

still_the_same_me@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
If you were going on a winter walk where some snow/ice was likely, but
nothing particularly difficult or dangerous, which would you take
first, and why? (Note the emphasis on walk - I don't mean
front-pointing up gullies.)

I used to think the decision was considered straightforward, but I find
that the majority of people I encounter in the hills (round here at
least - which is Japan) make the opposing decision.

James


Well, having instigated a lot of discussion and finding myself rebuked for sloppy thinking, I have to say "it depends" :-)

To get one variable out of the way, I *always* take poles. However, I have been educated by comments above to the possibility of arresting a slide with a pole, something I thought impossible. I still think that a pole will not work as quickly or as well as an ice-axe, so it is important to know the terrain before you set out - in other words, to have done the route before.

If you know your route, and the various escape routes you might need to shorten it, contain no steep slopes above vertical drops, but conditions are such that a slick frozen surface is likely, then crampons and poles are indicated.

If the route is new to you, or appears to have drops downslope, then an axe should be added.

For myself, I would always take an axe, partly because for a long time that was all I had. Also, an axe is a get-you-out-of-trouble tool, wheras crampons (allowing further progress where a non-crampon-equipped person would turn back) can be viewed as a get-you-into-trouble tool :-)

My axe is an ancient Stubai Aschenbrenner, wood-shafted and walking length (brushes the ground when held in the hand at my side). I would be very unhappy walking with a climbing axe, one of those short, artistically bent tools for spidering up frozen waterfalls :-)
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Relevant Pages

  • Re: Ice axe *or* crampons?
    ... It *is* reasonable, in some circumstances, to walk with poles and crampons but leave your axe on your pack. ... Much the same as I hope someone isn't rescued having broken a leg trying to self arrest on ice because he'd heard that axes were the most important thing and wasn't wearing crampons since they're optional extras. ...
    (uk.rec.walking)
  • Re: ice axe length
    ... I'm about 5'7 and I started off with a longer walking axe of about 65cm ... An axe is not a walking stick. ... It is interesting to interrelate walking poles and axes. ... However when crossing slopes I ...
    (uk.rec.walking)
  • Re: Ice axe *or* crampons?
    ... At the times I self arrested with poles in anger I was a rookie skier who hadn't developed any technique for arrest with them and had had no practice at doing that. ... First time, I found myself sliding, knew I'd be in bother if I carried on sliding, knew how to axe-arrest but all I had were the poles and having been told they could be used. ... What allowed me to stop was knowing how an axe arrest works and applying that knowledge to the tools I had to hand. ...
    (uk.rec.walking)
  • Re: Ice axe *or* crampons?
    ... particularly if there is snow over the ... ice and the crampons ball. ... Start sliding with crampons and poles, ... to cause you bother and trip you than a short axe which will always be ...
    (uk.rec.walking)
  • Re: Ice axe *or* crampons?
    ... I'd learnt to walk without tripping over my legs by the time I was ... think this is an aspect where the pole, axe debate comes in again. ... traversing steeper ground the axe is in your uphill hand so you don't ... My personal choice is thus to use two poles ...
    (uk.rec.walking)