Re: Bribery & Desperation

On 15 June, 19:16, "Stephen Rainsbury" <nos...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
"GAGS" <gags...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message

news:2b72c474-8eee-4734-895e-6eeb6b7d74e5@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

On 13 June, 23:16, "Stephen Rainsbury" <nos...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
"Chris.5th" <ch...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
GA on AMS doesn't belong to you. Period.

Why?


Okay I'll post this here, but this applies to a lot of you.

I have been out in the back yard diving in and out of the bins. I've
now found all my old GA notes.

I apologise. Once again my almost constant stupidity and ignorance has
been found out. You can claim GA on all subscriptions, i.e. Group,
district, County and HQ. So pretty well all of you were correct and
muggins thicko me was wrong.

Okay so now I know what's going on let's go back to earlier posts.

One reason touted for all this information gathering was for HQ to
maximise GA and associated finance.

Whoa there!!!!! How many ******* claims on GA do all you scouters
want?

If the SA has said something such as Groups can claim GA on all subs
(Group, District, County, HQ) then it can't just out of the blue start
claiming GA on those subs too.

So the GA argument here is a red herring. It will only become a reason
for the SA collecting all this information IF it changes its mind and
wishes to collect GA on AMS.

IIRC about 70% of groups claim GA. Not bad. But 30% don't and that's
potentially a lot of money.

It is a slightly curious arrangement - that doesn't mean it's tax-
dodgy - that a subscription for one charity is used to make a claim
for another. Will it remain so? Who knows, my guess would be it might
have a little longer to run but once D, C, and HQ gain an effective
administration of individuals it will change, imo. At the moment the
current arrangement is 'safe'. I do think that the tax man has been
quite generous in allowing this benefit.

What DB said about AMS is correct.

It is paid through the Group with the Group effectively acting as an
agent for the D, C and HQ. It will/should always be a null balance
transaction, i.e. £X in and £X out. It is levied on members (and some
others) and it is up to the Group to collect the money due, calculated
on its census submission. The Group can pay on behalf of its members
from funds if it wishes. Outside sponsors can also pay in the same
way. (In these cases you can't claim GA on these amounts.) If no one
other than the member is willing to pay, then the responsibility for
payment lies with the member. (Responsibility for payment always lies
with the member though it can be taken up by another person/body.) If
the member fails to pay then they lose membership.

If the SA were to go over to a complete members database then I think
in conjunction with this it would make sense for HQ to assume the GA
claim for the members' AMS. But is this the sole reason for a
comprehensive database? No.

Information is power. At present the SA lacks the information. With
the information it could potentially do a lot of things - things which
many would say were good and some where the opinion would be quite
different.

GAGS
.

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