Re: POR Update Due?


"Gooders" <gooders@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:R7KdnUcXl731Ld_anZ2dnUVZ8s-qnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxxxx

"Dave" <dave.barwickns@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:osednXh9ZYjbMN_anZ2dnUVZ8uudnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

"Gooders" <gooders@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:F-ednYR0pPwnjN_anZ2dnUVZ8tChnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxxxx

"marc" <initial.surname@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:JeSdnQQ294mkkt_anZ2dnUVZ8tvinZ2d@xxxxxxxxx
Manky Badger wrote:
"chris.5th" <chris.5th@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:21d7082b-56f3-4222-8b2c-

But in the example you quoted, what more insurance is needed than
that which
the centre was offering?
precisely! for scouts to do karting, one must purchase annual karting
insurance...

Why ?
Does the centre's policy not apply to scouts?
If the centre offers insurance, then that's the end of it?

POR: Chapter 8: Insurance
Rule 8.3: Compliance with Rules

1.

For insurance cover by Headquarters to be effective, the Rules of
the Association must be complied with, particularly those Rules
governing the organisation of activities and safety precautions
applying to activities.

2.

Some adventurous activities carry a potentially larger third
party risk than others, and appropriate insurance arrangements have
therefore to be made by Scout Insurance Services.

3.

For this reason, Groups, Districts or Counties undertaking the
following activities are required to notify Scout Insurance Services
beforehand:
*

Air activities;
*

Karting.


Common sense really!


And if you think that your Scout insurance is valid, you need to be
following the rules. The rules that are written in POR , not the ones
that you thought 30 other groups might have been following up to ten
years ago, but the rules that are in force now, today, and the onus is
on you to know and follow them, not "common sense"

So, in the event of an incident, whose insurance would you claim on? I
think that what MB is saying is that if the venue has sufficient public
liability insurance why double insure? The question then becomes what
level of insurance is the right level. And POR doesn't tell you that.

However, I suspect that the parents expect that their kids are insured
by the SA.

Stephen


I don't know lots about Insurance but the Kart Centre has LIABILLITY
insurance - that covers them in the event of an incident where they are
found to be liable. Where their staff may have done something that they
should not have etc, or something happened with the fabrication of the
circuit etc.

So if you have an accident that is not the centres fault you only have
the normal Scout Insurance PROVIDING you have told them before. This
insurance covers you for accidents where no liabillity can be pushed to
the other party.

Look at it another way like car insurance. If you are the driver of a car
and you have third party or TPFT and you have an accident that is proved
to be your fault; the insurance company will pay out for the damage to
the other vehicle and property, it will also pay for any claims for loss
of earnings from people in the other vehicles, your vehicle and any
persons otherwise involved EXCEPT you. If you are in hospital for 6
months and can't work you will get absolutely nothing.

Back to the Karting - have an accident where no liabillity and haven't
told the SA (as listed in POR) then the Scouts are not insured so it
would be you who would be taken to task for loss of earnings etc.

DaveB
West Yorks


But I think you have misunderstod the policy that we (and POR) are talking
about. In POR Rule 8.3 SIS are extending the cover of the Scout Liability
insurance, not to the Personal Accident and Medical Expenses Policy. It
specifically talks about third party risk. In other words you are
extending the level of cover afforded to you if you are found liable.

So in your scenario above you would be no better off as PAME will still
apply (but that's a separate thread).

Stephen


OK sorry if I misunderstood - but in that case the Kart Centre has insurance
for THEIR liabillity so if something was not their liabillity, the next
question is whether it is anyone elses liabillity.

Is it the Scout Leader (or other person supervising the Group from a
Scouting perspective) or is is another Scout that may have done something
stupid - again not the Kart Centre or the Scouters liabillity but another
Member.

They are covered providing the Insurance is there. If you haven't told HQ it
may not be there. So if this insurance is then required and as the Leader
you have not provided for it YOU could be held responsible but the insurance
may not cover you also because you failed to arrange cover.

DaveB
West Yorks


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: POR Update Due?
    ... If the centre offers insurance, then that's the end of it? ... POR: Chapter 8: Insurance ... following activities are required to notify Scout Insurance Services ... So if you have an accident that is not the centres fault you only have the ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Re: POR Update Due?
    ... for scouts to do karting, ... If the centre offers insurance, then that's the end of it? ... following activities are required to notify Scout Insurance Services ... So if you have an accident that is not the centres fault you only have the ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Re: POR Update Due?
    ... one must purchase annual karting ... If the centre offers insurance, then that's the end of it? ... POR: Chapter 8: Insurance ... following activities are required to notify Scout Insurance Services ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Re: POR Update Due?
    ... one must purchase annual karting ... For insurance cover by Headquarters to be effective, the Rules of the Association must be complied with, particularly those Rules governing the organisation of activities and safety precautions applying to activities. ... Some adventurous activities carry a potentially larger third party risk than others, and appropriate insurance arrangements have therefore to be made by Scout Insurance Services. ... I think that what MB is saying is that if the venue has sufficient public liability insurance why double insure? ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Re: POR Update Due?
    ... If our POR guru says "POR SAYS NO!!" ... you need to have the correct forms, insurance etc. ... you decide to take the scouts go karting... ... and if the shit had hit the fan... ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)