Re: what exec?

On Thu, 29 Jun 2006 17:28:23 GMT, "poison dwarf"
<newsgroup.2nd4th@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Thanks for attaching minutes, nice to finally receive a set, considering
been asking for minutes of every meeting since Xmas!
We want full disclosure regarding the concerns about the accounts, joint
activities, and why you are concerned regarding large payments from scout
accounts. Why not try actually asking us directly, we have nothing to hide!

We are both fed up of all these veiled comments, problems with accounts
etc., but no one willing to discuss what is wrong. I (Amanda) have had to
learn this account system on my own once John left for Scout section, but
no-one from the exec is willing to teach me or help me correct my mistakes,
but are more than willing to make veiled comments on the lack of accuracy.

Also, regarding statements about imposing rules onto the leaders. Why not
try a novel approach and discuss with us what needs to be done. Don't try to
impose rules in such an authoritarian manner, simply because the exec wishes
to cover it's back after it's own mistakes.

About the accounts, the situation is dire. Over a year after last set of
leaders left and still John has no control over his accounts, and cannot
even access a basic statement from the bank. When will this be resolved? It
is no longer something which can be tolerated and will be pursued further if
required.

Please try to remember that the leaders are an important part of the group,
and we do not like the way you are constantly trying to impose rules,
without consultation. Also the group can survive with out an exec but cannot
survive without leaders who are the front line. The exec main function
should be to support the leaders and to make the fund-raising and financing
of group activities easier, not to hinder, prevent or otherwise inhibit the
program, which is what is currently happening. The exec failed in it's
management of the accounts system with the previous leaders, but it is not
fair to try to make up for it by imposing draconion regimes for those who
remain and have continued to work in good faith and honesty.

The tents were flagged for purchase last year. They are not a surprise
purchase, but something that both the Cub and Scout leaders and assistant
leaders have been telling the group for over a year were urgent purchases.
The tents are 10 years plus in age, not 8 years, and we have had to struggle
and suffer on camps to stretch their life to this point.

It is not fair to state that the purchase was short notice, we have been
asking for these tents since last summer camp, but only managed to get
someone to take us seriously since this Easter. The rolling program has been
promised to us to renew tents since last summer, when we stated that the
tents were on their final runs.

We as leaders flagged up the necessary purchase of these items with plenty
of notice. It is up to the exec to sort funding, and any delay and lack of
notice lies with your area, not ours. The Cubs and scouts are entitled to
ask the exec to fund these purchases, as they are for the benefit of the
group, not for a specific section. For normal purchases the cubs and scouts
raise their own funds and purchase as required, as can be seen with new
kitchen supplies, games and general camping gear.

Regarding appointing of new quartermaster. This should be presented to all
members of exec, including leaders as we also have the right to vote on
this. Do not attempt to present us with a fait accomplai. We are full exec
members and will enforce this if necessary!

Joint activities. Cubs are the only section that has actually organised
events for both beavers and scouts to attend jointly with Cubs on various
events. As a result it is not unexpected that the expenditure and incomes
are higher than the others, plus the fact that the cubs are two separate
packs running from one account. This also means that beavers and scouts will
be paying large amounts to cubs, to cover costs for the various camps and
trips which take place.

Final matter for concern. Several leaders would like the opportunity to
attend an exec meeting as is their right, including John and myself
(Amanda). Yet meetings are planned at a time when it is obvious that leaders
cannot attend. With the lack of minutes available for these meetings,
concern is being raised as to how open the exec is, and how fair it is in
it's operating procedures.

Please arrange a meeting for all who wish to attend, allowing both exec and
leaders the opportunity to speak about the concerns within the group.

At the moment there is a distinct lack of communication, trust and faith
between the exec, uniformed members, and those who are supposed to represent
the leaders. The change in leadership in 2005 was meant to offer a new era
for the group, with open communication, team work and flexability to benefit
the entire group. In reality this isn't the case, and it is a poor show for
what could be a very successful group.

This email represents the feelings of both John and myself, and isn't aimed
at one particular person. However, we are not willing to stand by and be
walked over, ignored and taken advantage of. We work hard to run our
sections, as do the beaver leaders, and we do not apprecaite the politics
which is being forced upon us, when we (uniformed Leaders) would much rather
be focused on the children we work with, and know that the background
support is in place to ensure we can offer the best program, equipment and
activities for our own specific section, without having to jump through
hoops, deal with politics, or be dragged into petty squabbles.

No doubt we are now rubbing a few people up the wrong way, but to be honest
we have tried to talk to people, and have been ignored, misquoted or as
regarding the tents had the blame shifted onto us. This isn't to cause
trouble but to get things sorted, as this group is reaching crisis point,
and after the ***** situation we cannot afford any more financial or
personal situations to continue unresolved.

John & Amanda Lawrence
2nd/4th Barry

well you did ask!


I find the above difficult to digest. usually there is a reasonably
clear case one way or another. Here though there seems to be an
explosion of issues all coming to the surface at once. It happens.

It seems to me that there is a them and us situation and, for some
reason the Exec seem to think that they have the upper hand. Your GSL
should have made it crystal clear that the Exec is there to support
the Leadership provide Scouting for every member of the Group. That
means if the SL decidede to lead an expedition of Squirrel Patrol up
Everest, providing they have done the training, they are fit enough
and they have proven their committment, then the Exec is duty bound to
help raise the funds to make that happen.

Execs should always include the Leaders and again, it seems to me that
your GSL has been complicit in arranging meetings that Leaders cannot
attend.

Since I don't have sectional accounts funding here is a question of
ask and it will be provided. The situiation where Leaders leave and
signatories are not changed is limited by having the Exec the
signatories to accounts and issueing funds as required.

Once again on the question of equipment, the GSL seems to be at fault
as he should be supporting his leadership team. I don't quite
understand why anyone who takes on a role in Scouting should wish to
restrict acces to facilities or funds. Seems odd to me.

There does sem to be a conflict here that centres on mismanagement.
Oddly, that may have arisen as a consequence of , for some reason,
puting in place a tighter than average control on the Group by the
GSL/ and Chairman (I presume).

It is quite, quite possible to have a Group which has a management
that dots every I, crosses every T and has immaculate paperwork, but
gets very little in the way of Scouting done. On the other hand it is
quite, quite possible to run a Group with minimal management
intervention and do great things in Scouting.

Given the situation that has arisen with your Group, and it is always
worse with a husband and wife team involved - I know. There is a need
to step outside the ring and seek resolution - I'd say ask the DC for
some asistance but I suspect that would not help in this case 9for
some reason). So invite the Field Development Officer (whatever they
are called today) to step in and arbitrate.

There must be some common ground that can be cultivated to reap a
positive reward.

Ewan Scott



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Relevant Pages

  • Re: what exec?
    ... We want full disclosure regarding the concerns about the accounts, ... to impose rules in such an authoritarian manner, simply because the exec ... The tents were flagged for purchase last year. ... attend an exec meeting as is their right, ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Re: what exec?
    ... We want full disclosure regarding the concerns about the accounts, ... impose rules in such an authoritarian manner, simply because the exec wishes ... The tents were flagged for purchase last year. ... attend an exec meeting as is their right, ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Re: what exec?
    ... We want full disclosure regarding the concerns about the accounts, ... no-one from the exec is willing to teach me or help me correct my ... The tents were flagged for purchase last year. ... The Cubs and scouts are entitled to ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Styles of Exec
    ... The term 'Exec' is unknown to us because although I call it the 'Joint ... everyone else calls it the 'Parents Committee'! ... Before people start quoting POR and saying what can and can't be done, ... has to accept that many groups have no Exec or Leaders' meeting of any kind, ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)
  • Re: web sites
    ... >the basis of it is a scetions web site not an exec one. ... What can the Exec do? ... Is very much a Pack one, I think for the same reason. ... the accounts are too messy. ...
    (uk.rec.scouting)