Re: alcohol stove fuel and other questions

First off, thanks! You've given me afew ideas.

"Pete Verdon" <usenet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
message news:3mh94cF15oosbU1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Chris wrote:
> > I'm trying to design a yacht for my own use, and after thinking of
various
> > means to save electrical power for more important needs, I've been
toying
> > with the idea of using an alcohol burner stove.
>
> You mean you considered an electrical stove? That's an absolute
> non-starter on anything smaller than a 100ft gin-palace with 24/7
> generator. The usual method is a Calor-gas installation, though a few
> people do use alcohol stoves as you suggest.

Well, I've considered afew stove options, modified electric "hotplate", as
well as a charcoal grill on the deck rail outside. The alcohol seems
reasonable.

> > Oh, and while I'm at it...
> >
> > I've also been considering means to keep food cool without necessarily
using
> > a 12-volt refrigerator unit.
>
> Well, older boats sometimes don't have fridges, in which case you have
> to keep buying ice to keep them cool. In places like Greece where the
> water isn't drinkable they often sell frozen bottled water, which
> conveniently solves both needs. Alternatively, if you're going to be
> doing much motoring there are systems that have the fridge compressor
> attached to the engine, driven by the same belt as the alternator. This
> drives the plate down really cold, keeping the fridge cool until the
> next time you run the engine.

That's something to think about for sure.

> There are also gas fridges, but these aren't recommended on boats for
> safety reasons.

Yeah, I'm not comfortable with a gas fridge onboard. But then again, I
don't know many who would be.

> > Basically, my main uses of electric power would be..
> >
> > 1) Fridge
>
> If you want a fridge it's almost certainly going to need electricity, yes.

Well, either a full-blown fridge, or an icebox. Basically anything to hold
some food and drink cold. I have had warm drinks before, and I don't know
how the europeans can stand warm beer. ;-)

> > 2) Air Conditioning (fans)
>
> Like the electric stove, actual air-con is overkill on a yacht. A few
> fans shouldn't make much difference though.

Fans it'd be. I doubt I'd install a full A/C system. That'd be a huge
power hog, and abit of space that could be devoted to other uses.

> > 3) Heating
>
> Electric heating? Can I have some of what you're smoking? :-)

Well, my thoughts were some sort of electric heating element, and a piping
system and a mild blower to circulate warmed air through ducts. Maybe it'd
work, maybe not. Mostly just thinking out loud there.

> As far as electrical devices are concerned, the absolute biggest
> power-hogs are anything that produces heat. Trying to use electricity to
> heat a boat is nonsensical, even if you weren't trying to "save
> electrical power for more important needs".

Yeah, I wouldn't expect to heat the boat and keep it toasty warm, just
thought of kitbashing something to maybe take alittle of the nip out of the
air. With blankets and a wife with me, I can find other ways to do that.

> Heating on a boat (unless it's a characterful old one with a solid-fuel
> stove) is best supplied by a diesel hot-air heater, of the kind made by
> Eberspacher.

Or one of those fantabulous space-heaters that cause so many deaths by
spontaneous fire every once in awhile. ;-)

> > 4) Lighting and possibly Stereo
>
> Again, pretty definitely electrical, although some people do like to
> have a gimbaled oil lamp as well for subdued lighting in the evening.
> But small bulbs don't draw much power, and LEDs (if you're building this
> yourself) draw practically nothing.

LEDs are something to consider. Plus they last longer, so I wouldn't need
to be changing blown bulbs in hard to access places.

> > 5) Plumbing (water pump, salt extractors, etc..)
>
> Unless you go for a very basic water system with foot pump, you will
> need an electric pump for that. Watermakers aren't necessary for coastal
> cruising, but if you're using one for longer trips it will need power,
yes.

I figured I'd need an electric pump. I could probably manage a foot pump,
but I doubt the missus would mind cranking her foot before every shower or
washing of hands.

> If you decide you want running hot water, this can come from two sources
> - an electric immersion heater (for use with mains power when plugged
> in; see above re electrical heat) and a "calorifier" which is
> essentially a heat-exchanger with the engine's coolant loop. Run the
> engine for half an hour on the way into harbour and you get a nice hot
> tank of water for the evening.

The hot water advice is very useful, thanks!

> > I'm thinking one water system for the galley sink, and another for the
head and shower.
>
> You wouldn't normally fit separate systems, just two sets of taps on one
> system. The water pump pressurises the system, so that water flows when
> you open the tap. The pump senses the resulting drop in pressure, and
> starts up again until the tap is closed and the pressure is built up
> once more.
>
> > While I'm on the subject of power, what recharging systems are available
> > that can keep the batteries working as long as possible?
>
> The usual source for coastal cruising is the engine alternator, but
> depending on your sailing activities and power use this might not be run
> for long enough to keep the batteries topped up. If you tend to stay at
> marinas then you can plug into shore power which is very easy, but
> someone doing longer term cruising probably won't want to pay for marina
> berths every night. Wind, solar and, to a lesser extent, water (ie
> towed) generators are available, but to be honest these are more use for
> trickle charging batteries on boats left unattended than as a
> substantial source of power. Many serious cruisers carry portable petrol
> generators; many do not.

We'd be living aboard, or atleast much of the time. So that's why I think
methods to add charge to the batteries while sitting still or on the move
are a good idea. I don't expect to be running on shore power very much.

> Electrical power sources are one of the great debates of the sailing
> world; there is no right answer so read up on it and pick whatever mix
> of systems seems best to you.

Yeah, I'll read up on it more. Thanks.


.

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