Re: OT: Swearing in French [was: VOUS ETES ARRETÉ SUR MON PIED!]

"Dan Gregory" <dangregory@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> I don't really need to Google to find the dictionary definition.

I wasn't suggesting you do. Google is a rich resource of French (and
English, of course) as it's currently used. Go to the dictionary for
dictionary definitions.

> My son's school French dict. (1998) still has "baiser" as to kiss.

It's still the primary definition in my Petit Larousse (2003).

> Whereas the noun may mean that, the verb no longer does.

In context it does. Nowhere (that I know of) would "baiser la main du Pape"
be interpreted as "*** the hand of the Pope"!

> Although, yes, the original meaning is derogatory, my personal
> experience of living, cycling, racing, chatting, and swearing even,
> in France (some forty years) I still regularly hear the word used in
> exactly the same way as "cager" in English. Not polite but not
> necessarily a comment on the driver.

If this is the case (and it's not my experience), why isn't it reflected in
the usage Google records? Find me say a dozen examples from the first five
hundred hits.

> Ok much of this time was/is spent with "des vaches espagnoles" or in
> Paris but I do prefer to judge what I hear and say on a daily basis
rather
> than by what the dictionary says.

I think there's room for both.

My Robert Historique says:

CHAUFFEUR: ... Bien qu'il s'agisse de deux fonctions différentes, le mot a
glissé vers le sens usuel de <<conducteur d'un véhicule automobile>>
(1896), sens avec lequel il a produit le mot familier CHAUFFARD n.. (1897),
de suffix et de sens péjoratifs.

and Petit Larousse:

CHAUFFARD n.m. *Fam.* Conducteur d'automobile très imprudent ou maladroit.

and Collins-Robert:

CHAUFFARD n.m. (péj) Reckless driver ...

But beyond this, what I hear and say on every day, and the evidence I find
on the web, supported by my French friends here in Paris is that the sense
of the word is overwhelmingly pejorative. One friend says "c'est pas
seulement qu'il conduit mal. C'est plûtot qu'il le fait exprès." Another
"je dirait un très mauvais conducteur, un connard au volant".

Which I think brings us back to where we came in.

James Thomson


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