Re: Holocaust - - what if

On Thu, 02 Oct 2008 13:03:51 -0700, Nigel Worm scrievit this wi a finger
in the stour:

On Oct 2, 7:28 pm, Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bru...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Ariadne wrote:
On 2 Oct, 16:14, jake <j...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
What if Somme deniers started popping up, or Dunkirk deniers. Would
they be arrested?

See, that's the trouble with suppressing free speech - it quickly
becomes very selective.

So it should not be a question of making it illegal beacause if that
happened the thought police will soon be after YOU. Education of the
people to a degree where they can work it out for themselves is the
only way. At the moment of course that is the opposite direction to
the one we are traveling in Europe.

I was not aware that genocide was carried out either in the Somme or
in Dunkirk.

I am still not aware of living in Germany. In fact I don't.

Toben broke German law and a German
court issued the arrest warrant for him.

If he broke it while in Germany then the warrant is valid. If not it is
not justified.
What do you want next - extraditing UK citizens for breaking North
Korean law?

North Korea is not a part of the EU neither is there any extradition
treaty in existence between the North Korea and the UK. Regardless of
what we might think about it, there is an arrangement under which EU
countries each have extradition treaties with each other. The purpose of
this is to prevent law breakers escaping justice by crossing open
borders.

As the law stands at this moment Toben does not escape German justice
by virtue of his presence in the UK or indeed anywhere else in the EU
and that's the end of it.

Toben uses the internet in order to distribute his bile. There are very
few places on the planet where the internet cannot be accessed.
Increasingly states are taking this stark fact into account when
deciding jurisdiction. Indeed, bearing in mind that, in places, he uses
German on his site might be taken as evidence that he targets Germany
from the safety of Australia.

Historical revisionism in the sense that these people use it is simply
bogus. There is no such historical controversy except of the proponents
own making. I would be surprised to find that the topic was studied in
any reputable educational institution in the Western World. Despite this
there is no reason why anyone taking a PhD degree should not focus his
research on the holocaust.

I have been unsuccessfully trying to get hold of details of Toben's PhD.
I would bet that his research project had nothing to do with the
holocaust. I wonder why? He obviously holds a keen and "genuine"
interest in the topic.

Could it be that he is not as sceptical has he maintains and sees HD as
a tool with which to attack and defame others?

The free speech question is equally bogus. As far as I am aware, no
society has ever allowed any unfettered right of free speech. Taking our
own society,the right to free speech/expression has never been a defence
against incitement, defamation, deception, revelation of state secrets,
breach of duty of confidentiality, contempt of court, abusive/ insulting
behaviour.behaviour likely to cause breach of the peace, the performance
of lewd or obscene acts in public to mention but a few restrictions that
come to mind. The sate or society has always drawn lines even if such
lines can on occasion be vague or ill defined.

There seem therefore no reason why the state should not draw a line to
prevent individuals from using pseudo academic inquiry (which on the
most superficial examination turns out to be no such thing) to achieve a
more sinister objective which is to cause incitement towards, hatred
against, offence to a particular racial/religious group.

That's what it's all about!

I disagree with the premise that when an article is published on the
internet from one particular country, said article must 100% comply with
laws in _all_ other countries who have extradition arrangements with the
country of origin. This would be a legal minefield.
.

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