Re: on the arrogance of ignorance.....

On Thu, 20 Apr 2006 15:50:03 +0100 "TD" <tdefries@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"hummingbird" <OPRBMDQMZNLV@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Thu, 20 Apr 2006 11:18:23 +0100 "TD" <tdefries@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"hummingbird" <OPRBMDQMZNLV@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On 19 Apr 2006 13:00:40 -0700 "Stephen Horgan" <stephen@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

So when the Russians rolled into Hungary, Czechoslovakia and
Afghanistan they were just taking 'defensive measures'?

As I've already explained, the purpose of taking over those Eastern
European countries was to create a buffer zone between the motherland
and the West so that if a war was to be fought it would be fought
on their territory. America uses the exactly same strategy today. It
invaded Iraq (according to Bush's latest excuse) to "protect America".
Right?

How on earth can Iraq be a buffer zone around the USA in the same way that
the Soviet Union's 'allies' were a buffer against Western Europe?

OK. I was pointing out that Russia would have fought a war on someone
else's turf if it were necessary (Eastern bloc countries), thereby
protecting its homeland. Hence my analogy with America invading Iraq
where it was able to fight a war on another's turf.
Is that clearer?

I understood what you meant. ISTM the analogy is inappropriate.

You *did*? That's great.

Yes 'America' may have invaded Iraq to protect American interests. This
doesn't seem at all equivalent to the annexation by the Soviet Union of
neighbouring states. For one thing, there was the Brezhnev Doctrine.

See above.

Why do you turn a blind eye to what America does but criticise other
nations for doing the same thing? You're brainwashed are yer?

When the North
Koreans maintain a huge army with nuclear weapons while starving their
own people under a grim dictatorship they are just taking 'defensive
measures'?

Nothing to do with the Cold War.
But yes ...NK is taking defensive measures.

ISTM pretty obvious that the NK administration is trying to protect
_itself_, not NK. To this end they keep the North Korean people weak and
the administration strong, and arm themselves with nuclear weapons to
deter
any humanitarian intervention. What does the average North Korean get out
of it? Malnourished children? It's fine that these people are starving
and
repressed though, because the NK dictatorship is defending itself against
the evil West, right?

No, I dislike the state of affairs in NK. I also dislike them in Iraq,
Saudi, Syria, Libya, Zimbabwe, Rwanda, Chad, Sudan, Somalia, much
of Central Asia, most of the rest of Africa and 2 dozen other places.
I also dislike the abuse of police powers in Brazil.

What do you suggest we do about it?

I do not know what can be done.

Ooh dear and damn. I thought you had solutions lined up.

I'm sure there is a limit to what can be
done. My argument is with your opinion that the North Korean administration
is taking 'defensive measures'.

How would you describe them?

When Iran engages in a decade of deception to develop
expensive technology whose only purpose is the production of nuclear
weapons while most of their own people live in poverty and while
threatening to destroy Israel they are just taking 'defensive
measures'?

Totally unprovable and nothing to do with the Cold War.
But yes ....Iran is taking defensive measures.

ISTM a far better way for a 'country' not be attacked is to become a good
neighbour, avoiding the need to defend itself.

Can you tell me in what way Iran can be a good neighbour?

President Ahmadinejad should calm down the rhetoric, stop the organisation
that's funding 'martydom operations', and get on with the job of helping to
creating a nuclear weapons-free democratic Iran.

-He didn't start the rhetoric. Shouldn't Bush calm it down too?
-Afaik there's no proof of these 'martydom operations' you refer to.
-Afaik there's no proof that he's trying to create nuclear weapons.

Your solution amounts to him shutting up and doing what he's told.

--
politicians are the excrement of society and should be flushed away after every sitting.
.

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