Re: BBC show "hotel inspectors"

On 2009-04-13, Rowland McDonnell <real-address-in-sig@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Whiskers <catwheezel@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Rowland McDonnell <real-address-in-sig@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Whiskers <catwheezel@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Rowland McDonnell <real-address-in-sig@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Whiskers <catwheezel@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
used2be <used2be@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Rowland McDonnell wrote:
used2be <used2be@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

[...]

Sometimes I feel that it would be a good idea to break up the UK, give
full independence to England, let the other nations do their own thing
*entirely* (foreign policy, defence, and all) - just to show the little
nations just how badly things go for them without the English subsidy.

I'm in favour of 'greater regional autonomy' rather than 'splitting up the
UK'.

Well, it was a suggestion driven by exasperation at the constant barrage
of hatred and abuse from the non-English parts of Great Britain directed
a the English (the NI are a different matter entirely).

The loudest noise doesn't necessarily represent the majority opinion - or
even a significant minority.

[...]

But the frustrations of centralised misrule and (occasional) abuse
from Westminster and Whitehall do encourage some to seek complete
seperation.

Aye, but the corruption and so on in local government is even worse.

Possibly; but it's /local/ :))

And there are genuine historical greivances against 'the
English' in the 'Celtic fringe'; there isn't anything to be gained by
reviving them, other than trouble, but trouble is what a few people want.

<sigh> Oh aye - although from what I've been reading, the idea that
these islands ever got many Celts is not backed up by archaeological
evidence. Nor is the idea that the English are recent immigrants -
apparently, the archaeology shows that when the Romans left, the British
didn't bugger off and abandon the land but stayed put and were there
when the collapse of the Roman empire caused lots of immigrants to come
in.

I don't disagree. Note the 'quotes' I used for 'Celtic' and 'English'. I
think the notion of 'English' was invented at around the time the Saxons
(eg Alfred the Great) were rolling up the Danelaw - it's much easier to
'liberate our kin under foreign domination' than to 'impose our domination
on the foreigners next door', particularly if you can convince 'everyone'
that they really are 'kin'.

The concept of 'Celtic' as applied to cultures and peoples only dates from
the 19th century. The original meaning of the word was to group related
languages together. (Apart from Julius Caesar, who called all sorts of
'tribes' 'Celtic' with no apparent basis in fact).

It's a puzzle why the lingo changed in England, and why Britain got
Celtic languages before then.

Yes it is.

I think it's because everyone need to
talk to everyone else, and especially the people who you traded with,
and they were all Germanic speaking types (after the fall of Rome, this
is) in that direction so people had to learn the language. And Brits at
the time were used to learning the lingo - they'd had to when the Romans
where here, but the Germanic types had mostly told the Romans to go to
hell and so had no particular need to `do Latin'. I suspect it's
something like that. And something like that might explain the Celtic
language adoption. Or some other mechanism - there *is* evidence that a
small Celtic upper class might have moved in way back when, and that
means the local yokels have to learn a new language to `get on',
sortathing.

I suspect that Germanic languages came into use in eastern England (and
southern Scotland?) during the Roman period. It would be natural for
'cultural influences' to be exchanged across the North Sea in those days,
just as they are now.

The lack of archaeological evidence for violent large-scale invasions by
'Saxons' or 'Vikings' (another modern concept there!) is rather awkward
for those still favouring the 'post Roman invasions' theory.

But there's also archaeological evidence of cultural links between the
British isles and ancient Crete and that I find very intriguing. Maybe
the tale of Brutus coming here after the fall of Troy isn't so daft
after all... Well, they used to think that Troy itself was nothing but
a myth.

Rowland.

The sea is, and always has been, a highway not a barrier. Of /course/
there was 'contact' between Britain and the Mediterranean. Probably since
the earliest post-glacial settlements on these islands.

I think you might like this
<http://famouspoetsandpoems.com/poets/g__k__chesterton/poems/6729>.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
.

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