Re: Just venting (totally OT)

Mandy <mandy2uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

real-address-in-sig@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Rowland McDonnell) wrote in
news:1ibdnid.1tv22o7vuatmvN%real-address-in-sig@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx:

Mandy <mandy2uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

real-address-in-sig@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Rowland McDonnell) wrote:

Mandy <mandy2uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

real-address-in-sig@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Rowland McDonnell) wrote:

Mandy <mandy2uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

lying_***@xxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

x-no-archive: yes

Mandy <mandy...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

I've just found some resellers that sell Macs around here so
I'll see if I can persuade Steve to take me to each of them
so that I can have a look! :o)

I strongly recommend you find a friend who already has a Mac
and make sure it will run everything you need before you buy
one.

I don't have any RL friends... only online ones!

Online is all you need - but remember, since you can run Windoze
on a Mac, everything you've got now will work on a Mac.

I don't know if I can afford to buy Windoze though! :o(

Well, that's fair enough - and if you're not getting rid of your
Windoze computers, you won't *need* it.

Okey dokes!

<grin of an unrepentant geek> Yeah, but it's just so flash to see two
operating systems on the one machine... ;-)

It might be flash but it would overload my poorly brain! :o(

<bigger grin> Exploding brains are great!!!!! ;-)

But you've said what applications you use all the time - Poser
is available in a Mac version (both Mac and Windoze versions of
Poser are the same, at version 7), and while MS FrontPage is
discontinued by MS, there are much better Web page creation
tools around.

I doubt I'd be making pages on the Mac... not straight away anyway
:o)

Do ask on uk.comp.sys.mac about Web page creation software. I
gather that there's good stuff available, and you'll probably like
the experience once you've learnt how to use the software.


*nodding* I just want to get used to how to use the Mac first
y'know?

Oh yes, but how can you get used to using the Mac unless you, you
know, *use* it?

Just playing with it's no good at all - that'd be wasting your money.


I want to know how to turn it on and off first of all! lol

<grin> Push the power button. That's `on'. Select `shut down' from
the Apple menu - that's `off'.

[snip]

MS FrontPage - well, you should get something better even if you
stick with Windoze. But aside from that: ask on
uk.comp.sys.mac, explain that you use FrontPage now, and I'd bet
that you'll get lots of good suggestions on what'd be a better
replacement for you to use (they can probably advise you on a
replacement for FrontPage under MS Windoze too). For sure there
will be a period of learning, but whatever you get, it'll be
better than MS FrontPage. Remember, MS FrontPage was dropped by
MS some time ago, and it's always been the crappiest big name
Web page creation software out there.


Yup! I'm not going to build webpages on the Mac though so that's
no problem :o)

Mmm... But if you don't use it for the things you use computers
for, why buy the thing in the first place? No point spending money
on tool that's not used, is there? Thing before spending, yes?

I just want to get used to it first then if we (me and the Mac)
become friends I'll get a top notch Mac laptop and install all the
Mac software on it then :o)

That'd be a bit daft, really. You don't need a top-notch Mac laptop -
and the top-notch ones are very uncheap. The one you buy ought to be
perfectly up to doing everything you need. Seriously. Deadly
seriously - don't think of buying two Macs, really. Just the one.

Maybe I'd better wait until I've saved up a bit more money then?

The laptop Mac you mentioned on uk.comp.sys.mac is fine for your needs
as far as I can tell. Get the `cheap' one you selected and you will
probably not need to get a higher spec machine for when you want to
switch to a Mac full time. A cheap Mac is a high spec PC - you will not
need to `add bits' to it except for software and maybe some more RAM.

Stop thinking like you're buying a Windoze box! You're not - you'll be
buying a Mac, and everything's different in Mac-land.

If you can afford the Mac you spotted, you will have a Mac that will do
for all your computing needs for many years to come and the only upgrade
you're likely to want is more RAM and maybe a wireless network card
(okay, maybe the hard disc drive'll be too small for *everything* that
you might want to do).

Stop thinking that the cheap `low spec' machine you're looking at is in
any way inadequate for full-on `use it for everything' stuff. It will
be - you do not need to buy a better one. Not unless you want your
entire music library on it or something - but that might require an
external hard disc drive no matter what.

[snip]

Seriously, if you are going to `go Mac', your best bet is to get one
Mac and stick with that one Mac. Install on it the software you want
to use straight away, and play around with the things you want to use
on the Mac. Do a few jobs you want doing on it, that sort of thing.

The biggest problem with that is that I can't use PSP on it though :o(

Oh yes - that's why it's important to keep your Windoze computers for
now. What you need to do is find an Mac application that'll do for you
as a PSP replacement - and then get used to using it, which will take
time.

That's how to `get to be friends with it'. If you like it, you'll
just use it more and more as you get the hang of things. But if you
don't have software on it to do the things you want to do, you just
won't find out what it's like to use.

*nodding* That's why I was going to start off with something of low spec
and didn't cost the earth just to get used to it and then slowly put more
things on it before moving to a better spec machine and moving over to
that one

No, you don't do that with Macs. The low spec machine you are looking
at is a high spec machine by PC standards and has all the equipment you
need except it might want a bit more RAM plugged in (Macs are often
short of RAM when sold).

Macs aren't like other PCs: they come fully equipped. No need to do
piecemeal upgrades, no need to trade in for a higher spec machine
generally - you get a Mac, it does what you need and that's that. Maybe
more RAM - but that's about it, generally.

What you're thinking of doing is the wrong thing to do: think about the
low-spec Mac you're looking at as being `the machine you need'. It is.
It will do what you want and you do not need to think about adding
anything to it (except perhaps for RAM). You won't need a higher spec
machine for what you want to do.

instead of this one in a couple of years when I've saved up more
money, I would be used to how a Mac works and I would use the Mac instead
of Windows :o)

That's okay, except don't think about buying a better Mac in a few
years: the one you're looking at would do you for a long time yet.

Let me tell you a story: MacOS X 10.0 came out. It was very slow.
MacOS X 10.1 came out. It was a good deal less slow. MacOS X 10.2 came
out - coo! That one was definitely faster rather than `less slow' (if
you see what I mean). 10.3 - guess what? That's faster than 10.2. And
10.4 is faster than 10.3.

Things don't work in Mac land like they do in Windoze land, you know.

(In any case, you'd find it bloody annoying if you don't add /any/
software, I promise.)


I'd add Poser and a webpage making bit of software and take it from there
:o)

I'd add DragThing too if I were you, and a few other bits. Oh, Flip4Mac
and Perian so you'd have access to almost all audio+video file formats,
for example.

(none of that is supposed to make much sense to you - yet)

[snip]

I wouldn't suggest you (or anyone sane) bolt on all the bits I've
added, but there's a subset of my add-ons that I think really ought to
at least be considered by everyone. If you get a Mac, let me know,
and I'll lead you through it. I promise it'll be pretty much
painless, not very time consuming, and I can promise you'll understand
all the bits I think you should consider using. Cost of these bits?
Umm. It is /possible/ to add 'em all for free if you lack money and
aren't troubled by, erm...

I think I know what you mean and I'd prefer not to do it that way... it
may take longer to get the software on the machine but I'd be legal :o)

Fair enough - it's generally the better way. There is plenty of
shareware that you can use without restrictions and you just get nagged
to pay up. And beware of the rip-off shareware authors who break
consumer law. I don't see why they should get any payment at all, the
bastards.

[snip]

So: if you're an avid gamer, don't get a Mac. But otherwise,
it's a better bet than Windoze in general.

I mainly use the computer for email, building websites and using
PSP and Poser and I'll keep using Windows for all those, I just
want to play around with a Mac to see what it's like :o)

Best to play around with it at the jobs you want to do, or you'll
not really find out, will you?

I guess... I can't afford a lot of software for it though
unfortunately!
:o(

You'll find a /lot/ of shareware is available, and though one
shouldn't make suggestions like this, it's not always essential to pay
for the stuff.

It's essential for me!

I've got less keen on the idea of paying for shareware after some of the
recent rip-offs I've suffered. It's all well and good expecting payment
- no worries about that - but the user ought to be able to expect to
avoid being ripped off. And the buggers do rip you off, some of them.
How about paying full whack for some shareware which is made obsolete
within a month and then being expected to pay full whack for the
upgrade? Plenty of shareware authors don't bother sticking to consumer
legislation, so I've changed my mind about 'em lately. To something
along the lines of `I've been ripped off by so many of these bastards by
now that they're only getting the money if I'm convinced they're not
scum'.

I have a Big List of URLs. I have many useful Mac Websites listed in
it. Many of the bolt-on goodies I've got to suggest are freeware in
any case.


Groovy!

Freeware is often better than shareware for the same job, I've noticed.

[snip]

We don't have a network, just PCs and laptop that all use the same
router to get access to the net! :o/

Yeah, but hang on: that means you *DO* have a home network!

Even though I can't see the other machines that are connected to it?

Well, they'd have to have the right services turned on, and your
computer would have to be listening in the right way, and you'd all have
to have your filewalls opened up to permit traffic.

Arranging for the right settings to be set the right way on Macs is very
easy. From what I've read, doing the same on Windoze boxes is not so
easy.

Seriously: if all your PCs and laptops use the one router, they've all
got to be networked to it. Do they use wires, or is it wireless that
you use?

It's got wires I think

Righto - so you've got Ethernet, assuming that your Steve isn't
completely insane.

Not that it much matters, 'cos there will be an Ethernet port on that
router box which should allow a wired network connection to be made to
the household computer network which you really do have, honest.

Okay...

Erm. Of course, you can get `Wifi' (Airport in Mac language) -
wireless networking - for any modern Mac you like. But I prefer wired
networking, which is why I'm talking about doing it that way. I like
the reliability and speed of doing it over wires, you see, and I don't
mind putting a hole in a wall or ceiling for the wire to pass through.


Ah right!

Anyway, if they're all connected to the one router, they're all on the
home network, and you should be able to have them talking directly to
each other without a lot of bother. I've heard many horror stories of
setting up Windoze machines to do that sort of networking between each
other. I've no personal experience of doing so at all with Windoze.

AFAIK we didn't have any problems when we first got cable internet but I
think that is because we had a bloke to come out and do it for us!

Oh, but that's just getting it to see the internet via Ethernet. With a
Mac, you don't need to do any setting up: just plug the lead in from the
Mac to the router, and the Mac's on-line. Assuming that no-one's messed
about badly with the network settings, that is - they're set to work
like that by default.

I know how to do it with Macs: just go to *that* preferences pane,
turn on file sharing (if that's what you want to do), and then you can
log on to that Mac from any other machine on the home network just by
`navigating to the home network icon, and selecting the computer you
want to connect to'. Type in yer name and password, and Bob's yer
auntie's live-in lover.

You've gone over my head here... sorry!

Don't worry about it - if you get a Mac, you'll see as and when and
it'll be obvious.

[snip]

Hold on while I look on Amazon... looking at Amazon prices I can't
afford it and I was looking at used prices so I dread to think what
the New prices are!

They can be horrible[1] - but there are many, many versions of
Windoze. Oh look, you really do not *NEED* Windoze on a Mac, and it'd
be far too much brain-ache for you to figure out a sensibly economic
way of getting a version of Windoze that'd work right without breaking
the bank and let's face it, there's something more useful you could
spend that sort of money on, like a mountain of teddy bears or
similar. (more useful than another bloody copy of bloody MS Windoze,
I reckon - sorry, am I sounding miserably cynical again?)

Apparently we've already got a copy of XP (it was a shock to me as I
didn't know lol) but I don't know if it's Mac compatible... does that
matter?

Umm... Look, all versions of MS Windoze are sort of Mac compatible.
The only question is whether MS has made special arrangements to
/prevent/ the particular version you've got working on a Mac - many
versions of Windoze have limits built into them so that people have to
buy a more expensive version if they're doing something MS thinks they
should pay more money for.

I've not paid any attention to that at all - the way to find out would
be to ask on uk.comp.sys.mac if `Windoze XP version <blah>' will work
under Boot Camp (Boot Camp is the name for Apple's software to allow you
to choose which OS to use when you boot up).

[snip]

Rowland.

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