Re: NO NEED TO FEAR BIRD FLU

On Thu, 20 Apr 2006 10:29:28 +0100, Malcolm
<Malcolm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


In article <3lge421anphtfit3i6kv4o6dt0kvbhn2n6@xxxxxxx>,
amacmil304@xxxxxxx writes
On Thu, 20 Apr 2006 07:41:51 +0100, Malcolm
<Malcolm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article <asad42htjtqeskarhmjjnf4iv93532skbl@xxxxxxx>,
amacmil304@xxxxxxx writes
On Wed, 19 Apr 2006 20:15:36 +0100, Malcolm
<Malcolm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article <6MXEYeBCunREFwVE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Malcolm Kane
<malcolm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes

So as you are so worried about risks you will be barricading your self
into the house and getting rid of all sharp objects won't you?

Not to mention any ducks, geese and chickens. I wonder if Angus has any
cats. They've been killed by avian flu.

You've lost the argument and now into diversionary tactics :-))

Fact: cats have caught avian flu and died.

Not in the UK - Yet

No, but as close as Germany, which is quite probably where the dead swan
in Fife came from.

Yes and where many other could come from.


Fact: avian flu has infected less than 200 people worldwide, and all of
those were in very close contact with poultry.

Where did you obtain this information?

It's widely available.

Where? I understand from previous reports I have seen that not ALL of
those were in very close contact with poultry. So where did you get
your information?


Fact: no-one has caught avian flu from a wild bird.

Not yet, but wild birds carry the infection and it's entirely possible
that someone could catch AI from a wild bird.

It is possible, but then so is it possible to catch it from a cat.

So you admit it's possible. That's a step forward. All I doing is
suggesting that people stay away from reserves where infected birds
could be present.


Fact: avian flu has yet to mutate into something lethal to humans and IF
it does so expert opinion is that it will happen in China/south-east
Asia.

That's a guess. They simply don't know. Mutation could happen anywhere
and at any time. That's the danger and the authorities know it.

I personally give rather more credence to the views of acknowledged
experts in the subject to your dismissing those views as "a guess".

Are you saying mutation couldn't take place in Scotland?

But
then I'm not waging a vendetta against conservation organisations and
trying to persuade people not to visit their bird reserves because of an
unmeasurably low risk of catching bird flu from a wild bird. Your
refusal to accept that there are much higher risks from poultry and from
town parks where people are in direct contact with birds demonstrates
your dishonesty :-(


There is obviously a greater risk in places where a large number of
migrant birds congregate and if I was the parent of a small child I
would err on the side of caution and keep well away from bird
reserves.

It is undeniable that large numbers of migratory birds fly into the
reserves in the area where the infection was found and it is possible
and perhaps likely that some of those birds could be infected. There
is no question that migratory birds will bring more bird flu to the UK
if someone has a mild flu and comes into contact with infected
droppings, mutation could take place and a pandemic ensue. It's
prudent to avoid bird reserves until the risk recedes.



So, Angus, doing a simple risk assessment on the above, cats and poultry
should be avoided.

So you're saying cats and poultry should be avoided yet the people
should visit reserves where the most likely infection could be.

You're mad, Malcolm.

More silly abuse. You just can't cope, can you?

I can cope very well, Malcolm.

Am I right in thinking that you have both? Bad luck
:-))

Yes.

Oh dear :-(((((( or perhaps that should be :-))))))

The most likely route of infection will be through migratory wildfowl
that congregate in large numbers on bird reserves. That's why I
suggest it's prudent to avoid these areas and I think many people will
agree with me.

Bird flu has been spread around the world by movements (often illegal)
of poultry and poultry products, such as feathers. Bird flu occurs in
wild birds, at a very low level, and evidence that wild birds have
actually transmitted the flu to poultry rather than the other way round
is actually very hard to find.

Of course it is, you stupid man. Poultry are much more easily caught
for testing. Try catching swans and ducks in any number at Loch Leven
and you'll see what I mean.


Your continued refusal to accept that there are much higher risks from
poultry and from town parks where people are in direct contact with
birds than on bird reserves where people and birds are deliberately kept
apart, merely demonstrates your dishonesty, as I am sure many people
will agree.

The highest concentration of Whooper swans in the infected area is at
Loch Leven and I would suggest it is prudent to avoid visiting this
reserve.

if someone has a mild flu and comes into contact with infected
droppings, mutation could take place and a pandemic ensue.




Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk
.

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