Re: Only two possibilities existed.

Once again you are confusing the title president with the Guardian's
right to be "sacred head" of the UHJ. There is no rule, real or
imagined that precludes the UHJ having both a president who is elected
by the members and a Guardian who is appointed by his predecessor.
The Islamic Republic of Iran copied this system and uses it to this
day.

On Jan 29, 4:12 am, Nos...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
Hasl wrote:

"If Mason Remey had been appointed to the IBC and the rest of its
members elected Ross might have a point. But in fact they were *all*
appointed which signifies that there was nothing special about the
office of president of the IBC. Being president of the IBC did not
signify being the head of the House of Justice anymore than the fact
women served on the IBC meant they would serve on the House of Justice
as well."

This is a flawed argument, blowing the trumpet from the wrong side.
The Head or President of the Universal House of Justice, in any stage,
has to be appointed by the predecessor Guardian of the Cause of God.
Since only the Guardian can be the "sacred head" of that body, which
in the case of the first International Baha'i Council was Mason Remey,
he was appointed as the President of that body by the first Guardian.

The fact that members other than the "sacred head" of the embryonic
House of Justice were appointed by the first Guardian, as well, does
not reduce the significance or sacredness of the station of the Head;
it signifies only the position of those members who had the
potentiality of becoming a judge in the Baha'i Court (the second stage
in the evolution of the Council), as this same body, as originally
appointed, would evolve: "INTO OFFICIALLY RECOGNAIZED BAHA'I COURT" as
the "ESSENTIAL PRELUDE TO THE INSTITUTION OF THE UNIVERSAL HOUSE OF
JUSTICE" as clearly stated in Shoghi Effendi's Proclamation of 9
January 1951.

Regarding women being members of the International Baha'i Council, the
first Guardian clearly indicated that women could serve on the IBC, as
well as on the Baha'i Court and when the Court evolved to its third,
or elected stage, but they would not be eligible for election to this
body in it fourth stage as the Universal House of Justice.

"At present there are women on the International Council, and this
will continue as long as it exists, but when the International House
of Justice is elected, there will only be men on it, as this is the
law of the Aqdas."
(Directives from the Guardian, p. 80)
Nosrat

On Jan 29, 6:16 am, Hasl...@xxxxxxx wrote:

On Jan 28, 1:00 pm, Dream Lover <dreamlo...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Ross, exactly where does it say that their couldn't have been an
elected president of the UHJ AND a non-elected Guardian as a member?

Dream,

If Mason Remey had been appointed to the IBC and the rest its members
elected Ross might have a point. But in fact they were *all* appointed
which signifies that there was nothing special about the office of
president of the IBC. Being president of the IBC did not signify being
the head of the House of Justice anymore than the fact women served on
the IBC meant they would serve on the House of Justice as well. In any
case, this notion that the IBC was never activated is totally bogus.
It *was* activated at the time of the Guardian whether Mason Remey was
willing to acknowledge it as such or not. Prior to the Guardian's
passing NSAs were addressing their correspondence to the IBC and its
secretary wa answering that correspondence under the letterhead of the
IBC. It was certainly much more activated than the so-called Second
IBC upon which Joel M.'s claims rest. The court papers themselves
attest that this body never met and never performed a single task. At
most the Remeyites can establish that Mason Remey called it into
being. So? How is that different from the First IBC which actually did
things? In any case, the IBC continued to function during the period
of the Custodianship and increasingly took on additional duties until
it finally evolved into the Universal House of Justice. One stage of
that evolution was making the IBC an elected rather than an appointed
body and this is the point at which Mason Remey broke with the Hands.

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: NC Governor Should Resign Over Science
    ... to exhaustive appeals to the science head, ... college president, including my offer to demonstrate my X-Y-Z ... offers to demonstrate my X-Y-Z interferometer. ... Graduate School, Eva J. Pell, informing her that obtaining funding for ...
    (sci.physics)
  • The Man Who Would Be King
    ... The current President of the United States, acting in a way that would ... The country is in this position because all President Obama wants to ... there is a distinction between the head of state and the head ...
    (alt.politics.bush)
  • Re: Awfully quiet around here...
    ... find a handy Bourbon or Hohenzollern to put up as head of state. ... The rhetorical question is often posed "Would a President Blair be better?" ... IANA monarchist, and I think if other people were like me, we wouldn't need a monarchy. ... But there does seem to be a huge appetite for celebrity-worship, and I'd rather see that deflected onto a figurehead family without much real power than see someone who had real power and influence turned into a temporary celebrity. ...
    (uk.media.radio.archers)
  • Facts about Cubas one-party political system
    ... Facts about Cuba's one-party political system ... Cuba's National Assembly is widely expected to name Raul Castro as head ... head of government (as president of Council of Ministers) and ...
    (soc.culture.cuba)
  • Re: Should Cache be on the MV Family Tree?
    ... Tony Speed of mainlink fame was president of the international company. ... I worked the Anaheim Spectrum ... show with the president of the American division of IBC. ... > Do you recall anything about IBC? ...
    (comp.databases.pick)