Re: A Christian's view of Baha'i

Hi Larry,

You say I offered these arguments? I don't think so.

I would answer the arguments if someone were to make an assertions such as
Jennifer Bast makes.

Are you saying that she is right? Do you agree with her assertion that we
will see:

Christ returning with the saints on the clouds.
The mount of olives will be split in two when he stands on it, the battle
of
armagedon will unfold, Satan will be bound...

Are you awaiting such an occurrence, Larry? Do you believe this will happen
as she describes it?

--Kent


"Heather Carr-Rowe" <rowe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:Uu29g.7811$aq5.352416@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
The arguments he refers to Kent are the same ones referred to by Jennifer
Bast in her article which can be found here:

http://contenderministries.org/bahai/bahaidebate.php

BAHA'ULLA'S CLAIMS

In the mid nineteenth century Baha'ulla claimed - with power and
authority_to the Christians of the world that He fulfills the Bible's
sacred
promises concerning the Return of Christ: "Jesus, the Spirit of God hath
once more, in my person, been made manifest unto you."(He Cometh with
Clouds: A Baha'i View of Christ's Return by Matthews) In many of
Baha'ulla'
s writings he boldly proclaims that he has fulfilled the second coming of
Christ, even making these astounding assertions in a letter written to
Pope
Pius IX.

Not only did Baha'ulla claim to be the second coming of Christ, but also
the
Mahdi or twelfth Imam of Islam, the ninth Avatar of Vishnu of the Hindus,
the Maitraya Buddha of Mahayana Buddhists, Shah Bahram of the
Zoroastrians,
and "the Prophet" of Moses. In essence, Jesus is reduced to a
manifestation
or mirror image of God, and only one of many. Even more offensive to
believers in Christ as Lord, Baha'is believe that Baha'ulla is the latest
and most correct of all the Manifestations in God's continuing revelation.
Most Baha'is, using their circular logic will argue this is not true and
all
the manifestations are equally God. However, they will claim that Jesus
was
the manifestation only for that time and Baha'ulla is the messenger for
this
time. In other words the message of Baha'ulla is more correct for us than
the message of Christ. Jesus message has been replaced.

Of course the Baha'i will then claim that they still revere the Bible and
read it regularly. However if you get in a discussion with a Baha'i and
present biblical supports for your beliefs, they will quote the writings
of
Baha'ulla and his symbolic interpretation of the promises, prophecies, and
message of the Bible. Rather than looking to the Bible for answers they
look to the interpretation given by Baha'ulla. Clearly they do not view
the
Bible as the infallible word of God, nor do they base any of their beliefs
solely on the Bible. Therefore, using the Bible to show them the error in
their false religion proves to be an endless circle of reinterpretations.
If the Bible clearly shows Baha'ulla to be a false prophet, you can be
sure
he created an interpretation that fits his purposes, usually by using
symbolism and tortured rewording.
A SYMBOLIC SECOND COMING

You might be wondering how the Baha'i can claim that a man born to
ordinary
parents, originally a Muslim, could be the second coming of Christ. The
Bible clearly says that Christ will return the same way he left us. We
are
given several description of Christ returning with the saints on the
clouds.
The mount of olives will be split in two when he stands on it, the battle
of
armagedon will unfold, Satan will be bound, and countless other prophecies
regarding end time events will be fulfilled. These prophecies definitely
weren't fulfilled in 1844 with the Bab's arrival. Pick any one of the
end-times scriptures however, and the Baha'i will provide from the Baha'i
writings a symbolic interpretation that conveniently fits into the Baha'i
beliefs. If the scripture you choose has no reinterpretation provided for
in their writings, that's no problem either. They can always fall back on
the claim that the Bible has been corrupted. One particular Baha'i, when
presented with scripture regarding the darkening of the sun and the stars
falling from heavens before Christ's glorious appearing (Matthew
24:27-31),
answered by saying that "when Baha'ulla was born there were some shooting
stars and a meteor shower". The rest of the verse she explained
symbolically. For example Jesus returning on the clouds the same way he
left us is reinterpreted to mean it will be dark days when He returns.
And
of course they argue our world was dark and troubled when Baha'ulla
returned. When you look at these symbolic explanations for scripture
closely even their twisted version of prophecy has serious flaws.
PROBLEMS WITH THE 1844 ASSERTION

Daniel 8:13-14

"Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to him, 'How
long will it take for the vision to be fulfilled - the vision concerning
the
daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender
of
the sanctuary and of the host that will be trampled underfoot?' He said
to
me, 'It will take 2,300 evenings and mornings then the sanctuary will be
reconsecrated.'"

The Baha'i will point to Daniel and make the claim that the prophecies in
this book reveal a timeline in prophetic years instead of days as the
scripture says. They claim that this timeline in Daniel 8 began with the
edict given by King Artaxerxes in Ezra (7:12-26) and the 2,300 year period
ended in 1844 when the Bab (the forerunner to Baha'ulla) made his
declaration to the world that he was a manifestation of God.

This prophecy was given to Daniel by the Angel Gabriel. The first obvious
problem with this being a prophecy of the exact time of Christ's return is
that the Bible is clear we will not know the day or the hour of His
return.
Even the angels in heaven do not know the time, but only the father. The
Angel Gabriel could not have given a specific date for Christ's return as
he
did not know the time.




.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: A Christians view of Bahai
    ... authority_to the Christians of the world that He fulfills the Bible's sacred ... Jesus is reduced to a manifestation ... symbolism and tortured rewording. ... armagedon will unfold, Satan will be bound, and countless other prophecies ...
    (talk.religion.bahai)
  • Re: The 7 times of the curse and the 70 weeks
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    (soc.religion.bahai)
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