Re: Shoghi Effendi seems to think the Will and Testament is Baha'u'llah's



PaulHammond wrote:

ausgepotchket@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

"For nothing short of the EXPLICIT DIRECTIONS OF THEIR BOOK, and the
surprising EMPHATIC LANGUAGE WITH WHICH THEY HAVE CLOTHED THE
PROVISIONS OF THEIR WILL, COULD POSSIBLY SAFEGUARD THE FAITH for which
they have both so gloriously labored all their lives.  NOTHING SHORT OF
THIS COULD PROTECT IT FROM THE HERESIES and calumnies with which
demoninations, peoples, governments have endeavored, and will, with
increasing vigor, endeavor to assail it in the future".

Jeff, how could anyone possibly interpret this to be anything other
than obedience to a living Guardian under the provisions of The
Master's Will and Testament to ensure the integrity and unity of the
Cause of God?

Michael 


Michaal - I don't see how you get your interpretation from the
above paragraph (with your emphases added) - that paragraph
doesn't mention the phrase "living Guardian" once, so where
are you getting that from?


I'm thinking that that necessary ingredient comes from the conclusion.

Also, I'd point out that Abdu'l Baha's will was largely
written in order to justify Abdu'l Baha's decision to
change the provisions of Baha'u'llah's will, and alter
the course of succession from Muhammad Ali to create a
new form of leadership in the Guardian, and appoint his
grandson Shoghi Effendi to that position.




Since Shoghi didn't leave a will, contrary to the terms of
the Aqdas, anything here is pure speculation, but who is to
say that Shoghi's will again might have altered the provisions

Ehhh, even though a will is prescribed in the Kitabi Aqdas, it should not have been the vehicle for appointing a successor, since the lauded book, the safeguard of the faith, the fruit of such glorius labor, in clear, emphatic language laid out the means by which Shoghi Effendi would appoint his successor to the Guardianship: he would provide the name of his nominee to a body of the hands of the Cause, who, in turn, would assent to the nomination. This emphatically clear process would leave no doubt whatsoever as to who the Guardian's successor was to be.

Clearly, this process had not been followed by the time that Shoghi Effendi. To my recollection, all of the Hands of the Cause (Yes, Charles Mason Remey, among others) informed the Baha'is that Shoghi Effendi passed away without a successor.

of Abdu'l Baha's in directions that might have been
surprising to the Baha'i World.

It just seems odd that since Abdu'l Baha himself altered
the terms of Baha'u'llah's will to meet the changing
circumstance of his time that you followers of one
or another various claimant to be a Baha'i Guardian
should imagine the terms of the will and testament as
if they were set in stone as permanently as the ten
commandments.

It is all odd, since these same people who would pose as the staunch adherents, not only ignore the requirements for succession (assent of a body of nine Hands), but also ignore the conclusion of their would-be Guardian, that Shoghi Effendi had died w/o appointing a successor.

Perhaps Baha'is still feel traumatized by the loss of the Guardianship, and these Remeyites use that as a sore point, in which to insert a sharp stick. They don't seem to realize that what they are saying makes no sense. The only thing being hurt is the credibility of the one who tramples on the "Will and Testament" by abrogting the provision for the Guardian to have the Hands assent to his successor (regardless of sonship, Shoghi Effendi's will, etc.), and then, parade about like they really care about the "Will and Testament" of 'Abdu'l Baha, so much more than any other Baha'is.

- All Bad

.

Relevant Pages

  • =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:_True_Authority_in_the_Bah=E1=ED_Faith?=
    ... Every excuse made, for the lack of a successor, ... challenged the authenticity of the Will in court. ... Guardian - the twin pillars. ... Shoghi Effendi obviously made a mistake by not being forthcoming on ...
    (talk.religion.bahai)
  • Re: hands of the cause
    ... did it ever occur to you that Shoghi Effendi who was ... in his 50's wouldnt likely appoint a man in his 80's to be HIS ... Their choice of successor is divinely guided ... Guardian of the Faith in the Will and Testament. ...
    (talk.religion.bahai)
  • Re: How the Guardianship passed on
    ... When he turned the "affairs of the Faith" over to Joel B. Marangella, ... the successor (Joel B Marangella the third Guardian of the ... appointment and at the same time, an assurance for the preservation of the ...
    (talk.religion.bahai)
  • Re: How the Guardianship passed on
    ... When he turned the "affairs of the Faith" over to Joel B. Marangella, ... the successor (Joel B Marangella the third Guardian of the ... appointment and at the same time, an assurance for the preservation of the ...
    (talk.religion.bahai)
  • Re: How the Guardianship passed on
    ... the successor (Joel B Marangella the third Guardian of the ... appointment and at the same time, an assurance for the preservation of the ... Guardianship and protection of the Faith. ...
    (talk.religion.bahai)