Re: conservatives more likely to be vegetarians



rick wrote:
> <shevek4@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:1121441938.094996.245220@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> >
> > rick wrote:
> >> <shevek4@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> >> news:1121355365.772453.179780@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > rick wrote:
> >> >> "Ron" <banmilk@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> >> >> news:1121280634.644681.73280@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > shevek4@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
> >> >> >> rick wrote:
> >> >> >> > <shevek4@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> >> >> >> > news:1121095611.867982.155180@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> >> >> > >
> >> >> >> > >
> >> >> >> > > Rudy Canoza wrote:
> >> >> >> > >> shevek4@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
> >> >> >> > >>
>
> The 1st is obvious - the sun's energy has a
> > more direct and efficient route to my metabolism if I eat
> > vegetables
> > directly rather than filtering the energy first with another
> > animal.
> ==================
> No fool, it's not obvious. You can eat meat that requires
> absolutly NO human derived inputs. It provides your energy from
> the same sun source, but without all the petro-chemical industry
> inputs that YOUR veggies require. You kill far more mammals,
> birds, reptiles, fish and amphibians that ae necessary. Probably
> more than some meat-included diets. Too bad you'e too
> brainwashed to see the truth, hypocrite.
>

Yes, again I acknowledge you can eat such meat - and that there exist
omnivorous and even carnivorous diets that are healthier and
lower-impact than some vegetarian diets. That doesn't contradict my
points - such cases are exceptions to a trend.

What fraction do you think of meat eaten today is of that variety? As
you know more petro-chemicals are used overall per average meat calorie
than per average vegetable calorie. Also, even the sustainable hunter
is getting his energy through a less efficient route - the solar energy
to human metabolism efficiency is lower.

>
> >
> > The 2nd is observed epidemiologically. Cancers are less
> > prevalent in
> > societies where people eat less meat
> ====================
> Again, you're too stupid to understand, eh? "less meat" is not a
> veg*n diet, fool.
>
>
> - removing meat from your diet has
> > been shown to correlate with better health and physical
> > endurance.
> =================
> No, it hasn't. except by loons with an agenda based on anecdotal
> spew...
>

It's been known for a long time! Here's yet more examples:



------------
'Users of low-protein and non-flesh dietaries have far greater
endurance than those who are accustomed to the ordinary American diet'
- Prof. Irving Fisher, Yale University, 1906. For centuries people
believed that meat was important for athletes and the 19th century
German chemist Liebig proposed that the energy for all muscular
movement came from protein. But by 1850, scientists knew that the
important fuels for physical activity were actually carbohydrate and
fat, not protein at all. Despite these findings, the protein in meats
continued to be favoured by athletes well into the 20th century.

As recently as 1970, the meals of choice for Sri Lankan athletes
included meat and eggs. Even in the schools I was educated at, in the
1950's, our teachers used to advise the athletes to consume eggs and
meat.

Long before meat based diets fell out of favour for athletes there were
successful vegetarian athletes. Prof Irving Fisher of Yale University
was intrigued with the physical endurance of "meat -abstainer"
athletes. Prof Fisher studied three groups (a) meat eating athletes(b)
vegetarian athletes and ( c) A group of sedentary vegetarian nurses and
physicians in Michigan. His results showed a remarkable superiority of
vegetarians in all tests of endurance. The vegetarian athletes and
sedentary vegetarian nurses and physicians were superior in all
endurance tests to meat eating athletes (Yale Med J. 13,205-21, 1907).
--------

Other more modern examples are easy to find, e.g.:

-------
Astrand, Per-Olaf, Nutrition Today 3:no2, 9-11, 1986

In 1986, a Danish team of researchers tested a group of men on a
variety of diets, using a stationary bicycle to measure their strength
and endurance.

The men were fed a mixed diet of meat and vegetables for a period of
time, and then tested on the bicycle. The average time they could pedal
before muscle failure was 114 minutes.

These same men later were fed a diet high in meat, milk and eggs for a
similar period and then re-tested on the bicycles. On the high meat
diet, their pedalling time be-fore muscle failure dropped dramatically
- to an average of only 57 minutes.

Later, these men were switched to a strictly vegetarian diet, composed
of grains, vegetables and fruits, and then tested on the bicycles. The
lack of animal products didn?t seem to hurt their performance - they
peddled for an average of 167 minutes. 5
-------------


> >> =========================
> >> ALL farming is egological damage dolt. It destroyed a natural
> >> habitat and replaced it with a very unnatural one.
> >>
> >
> > OK, but the question is which farms are you going to support.
> =========================
> You tell us fool. Afterall, it's YOUR claim to be the one that
> 'cares' about animals and the environment. Thanks for yet again
> proving you haven't thought any of this through beyond your
> simple rule for your simple mind, 'eat no meat.'
> If you have to buy all your foods, then the only thing obvious
> for you to do is eat an omnivorous diet. A diet that includes
> grass-fed meats and game. The former being available all over
> the country. Othewise, all your foods are a product of the
> petro-chemical industry from seed to shrink-wrapped processed
> goo...
>

I do periodically check my local markets for meats that have at least
their place of origin marked. It's surprisingly rare to find such
around here, and even more rare to have information about the amount of
petro-chems etc. It's usually far more of those used in meat
production than e.g. organic grains. "Available all over the
country" may be true in theory.. yet most restaurants don't even know
what time zone their meat comes from, yet alone how it lived.


> >> - antennas
> >> > can kill birds, etc. etc..
> >> =====================
> >> Antennas DO kill birds, by the millions and millions... Why
> >> the
> >> dancing around the edges, killer?
> >>
> >
> > I'm not dancing around any edges. I'll shoot birds myself if I
> > have
> > to.
> ==============
> Thanks or again proving that being veg*n means nothing in regards
> to 'caring' about animals.
>

No problem. I have always said veg*n is actually about taste and diet
and doesn't -necessarily- mean anything w/ regards to 'caring' about
animals.

[..]
>
>
> A vegetarian diet is not "better
> > automatically", it is simply more likely to be conservative of
> > health
> > and natural resources than an omnivorous one.
> >
> > Another one for you. My diet (being from the US) is more
> > likely to be
> > wasteful of health and natural resources than that of a
> > foreigner.
> > ===============
> Yet you really do nothing to change it. Why is that, killer?
>

I've told you several things I've done to change it. I've heard you
insinuate you've done some things to beat the average as well. Keep up
the good work, killer.

.

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