Re: Collins to head NIH?

On Jul 29, 1:27 pm, Garamond Lethe <cartographi...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On 2009-07-29, snex <x...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Jul 29, 12:59 pm, Garamond Lethe <cartographi...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On 2009-07-29, snex <x...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


Hint: there are lots of different types of evidence.

and you still havent told me whether or not *it happened.* if you cant
do that, then your assertion that your method is a means of
questioning religious claims is bull***.

Nonsense. For all reasonable interpretation of the word "challenge", to
say that "The Virgin birth as described in Matthew 1:18" only means
Mary was very young when she conceived" is a challenge to the current
religious , and if it is based on an argument of the form: "and we know
this because of our improving understanding of Aramaic" then it is
evidence based challenge

you still havent told me whether or not the event *happened.*

You haven't answered that question either, come to think of it.

Did the virgin birth occur?

Yes or no?

Not just your opinion, of course, we'll need to see some evidence.

You do have evidence for your opinion, right?

Or is this just your opinion?

the *evidence* indicates that human virgin births *never* occur
without technological intervention.

Hmmmm... no, not quite, (and that's why you won't be able to find a
citation to that effect).

yes moron, quite. the reason you wont find a "cite" to that effect is
the same reason you wont find a "cite" to the effect that the sun
rises in the east every day. we *all see it.* nobody needs to perform
any experiments. its just right there.

C. H. Brown, "Where do cardinal direction terms come from?"
Anthropological Linguistics, 1983

Or perhaps more to your point:

<q>
“How does the location of sunrise and sunset change throughout the year?
The sun appears to rise on the eastern horizon and sets on the western
horizon. How much does the location of the sun rising and setting change
throughout the year and depending upon where your viewpoint is, i.e.,
true East, true West, etc. Irrespective of where you are on the globe,
the Sun will always rise exactly East and set exactly West on two days:
March 21 and September 21 which are the two equinoxes. As to the
second part, it is a little complicated:
</q>

From "The Sunset Observations Project".

Your turn. Cite, please.

none of this is a cite to an experiment showing that the sun rises in
the east every day. it simply takes the matter for granted. just like
we all take "sex makes babies" for granted. grow a brain, idiot.


or are you going to claim that the sun rising in the east every day
isnt relevant to science?

It's so relevant that it is studied and I have no difficulty tracking
down citations.

and you think that human reproduction isnt studied? are you serious?


I'd like to see your evidence now.



until somebody offers evidence that 1) human virgins can naturally
give birth, and 2) the mother of jesus satisfied the conditions
necessary for (1), the only reasonable position to take is that it
probably did not happen.

Exactly. Another way of saying that is it would take a miracle for
it to happen. I believe you are now in agreement with Collins on
the biological question here. Neither one of you can definitively
say whether a miracle occurred or not, and so most people decide
to live and let live at this point.

WRONG! collins says that *it happened.*

But as this is a belief that is not amenable to evidence, and he
realizes that, that's fine. If Collins said that it happened and
no miracle as involved, then you might have a point.

it doesnt matter "how" he thinks it happened. he is making an
assertion about an event in the natural world that he has no evidence
for. and you are refusing to criticize him for it.


and morons like you, instead
of criticizing him for it, tell the rest of us to shut up when we do.

I wouldn't dream of telling you to shut up. I'm trying to get a
very complex, difficult paper written up for a conference deadline
on Friday and it's refreshing to come in here, turn most of my
brain off, and still run circles around you.

only in your dreams liar.


Now I believe you have some evidence as to why you think the
virgin birth didn't happen.

You do have evidence, right?

the evidence that the virgin birth didnt happen is the same evidence
that the sun didnt rise in the west one random day 2000 years ago.

.

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