Re: What natural selection can do - whoisyourcreator.com

On Tue, 07 Apr 2009 14:59:44 +1000, John S. Wilkins wrote:

Garamond Lethe <cartographical@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 10:50:31 -0400, Steven L. wrote:

backspace wrote:
http://www.whoisyourcreator.com/natural_selection.html

=== What Natural Selection Can Do: === Natural selection can
preserve a change in an existing trait or feature by having
organisms with that change survive and reproduce at a higher rate.

=== rephrase ===
Natural selection preserves a feature by having organisms with that
feature survive.

Question:
Other than noting the feature survived how was the its
preservability measured?

You are arguing that natural selection is a tautology.

This argument has been made many times in the past--and it's been
refuted.

In the modern ToE, fitness is NOT determined by survival and
reproduction. It's a more objective trait, of the organism's
abilities to function in its environment. But even if it has
slightly superior fitness for its environment, it may still be
gobbled up by a predator before it even has a chance to reproduce.
Life's a bitch. And who survives long enough to reproduce is often a
matter of luck.

Hmmmm.... my textbook gives the following definitions:

fitness: The number of offspring left by an individual after one
generation. The fitness of an allele is the average fitness of
individuals that carry that allele.

fitness component: Traits, such as survival, mating success, and
reproduction, that combine to determine fitness.

If you have a cite for your definition of fitness I'd be interested to
read it.

It's called the "propensity" definition of fitness. Mostly it's proposed
and defended by philosophers:

<snip references>

Just glancing through...

"We argue that a fashionable interpretation of the theory of natural
selection as a claim exclusively about populations is mistaken. The
interpretation rests on adopting an analysis of fitness as a
probabilistic propensity which cannot be substantiated, draws parallels
with thermodynamics which are without foundations, and fails to do
justice to the fundamental distinction between drift and selection."

Looks like fun, thanks!

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Self-replication incompatible with stability
    ... "fitness" remains non refutable. ... possible EMPIRICAL way to 100% halt natural selection within any natural ... number of fertile forms that you reproduce into one population. ... evolutionary theory to endless versions of Post Modern polycentric forms ...
    (sci.bio.evolution)
  • Re: What natural selection can do - whoisyourcreator.com
    ... change survive and reproduce at a higher rate. ... Natural selection preserves a feature by having organisms with that ... fitness for its environment, it may still be gobbled up by a predator ... survives long enough to reproduce is often a matter of luck. ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: What natural selection can do - whoisyourcreator.com
    ... change survive and reproduce at a higher rate. ... fitness for its environment, it may still be gobbled up by a predator ... survives long enough to reproduce is often a matter of luck. ... Philosophy of Science 49:268-273. ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: What natural selection can do - whoisyourcreator.com
    ... change survive and reproduce at a higher rate. ... fitness for its environment, it may still be gobbled up by a predator ... survives long enough to reproduce is often a matter of luck. ... Philosophy of Science 49:268-273. ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: What natural selection can do - whoisyourcreator.com
    ... change survive and reproduce at a higher rate. ... fitness for its environment, it may still be gobbled up by a predator ... survives long enough to reproduce is often a matter of luck. ... Philosophy of Science 49:268-273. ...
    (talk.origins)