Re: God and evolution: One evangelical minister says the two go hand in hand.


"(M)-adman" <grat@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:5wNRk.67129$vX2.55812@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

there are other more severe punishments, but these should do for
such a pimple of a preacher that gave up 3 churches to travel around
selling lies for money.


Well many of them travel to preach and most take money in some form
(they eat too) so I don't suppose you would want to bring down such
punishments on every travelling preacher who takes money.

Jesus was clear. Accepting hospitality, accepting food, not a problem.
Because the worker is worthy his meal. So accepting enough money to live
on, not a problem. The real reason Jesus gave these instructions for is
because money corrupts. Jesus knew this. He tossed the money changer's
table in the temple and said render to Ceasr what is Ceasar's. (refering
to a coin) When money is involved, there is corruption and very little
real truth.


Quite so. In this respect money-grabbing evangelists are indistinguisable
from secular gurus selling self-improvment. The opportunities for scams are
greatest when the system the scammers work in is not built on evidence and
accountability. Would you agree?


However, please feel free to explain how million dollar airplanes and
owning several multi-million dollar homes along with an obscene bank
account fits into Jesus' ministry of truth. When Jesus sent deciples out
in his name, the instructions were:

"9 Do not possess gold, nor silver, nor money in your purses: 10 Nor scrip
for your journey, nor two coats, nor shoes, nor a staff; for the workman
is worthy of his meat. 11 And into whatsoever city or town you shall
enter, inquire who in it is worthy, and there abide till you go thence. 12
And when you come into the house, salute it, saying: Peace be to this
house. 13 And if that house be worthy, your peace shall come upon it; but
if it be not worthy, your peace shall return to you. 14 And whosoever
shall not receive you, nor hear your words: going forth out of that house
or city shake off the dust from your feet."


So what criteria do you use to distinguish the "true" shepherds and
teachers from the "false"?

I trust my own readings and research. Because after 2000 years, and living
in a materialistic society, I feel there are no true to-the-exact-meaning
teachers.

Nobody knew you were that old, you should get more respect around here.

There are some honest ones that try really hard, but, not many of
them have any real training in ancient history. Many of them know nothing
of the historical origins of what they try to teach. And, many of them
simply do not understand the ancient languages well enough to even attempt
an accurate teaching.

The council at Nicea tossed much that was written down as unfit; which was
indeed fit. So the very book they use to teach from is often
misunderstood. It is riddled with contradictions, but only because there
are no corresponding English words to capture an accurate meaning of what
was being communicated. This is where a good teacher comes in. He can
teach the sheep and keep them from scattering, as we see today. Many do
not believe in God simply because the bible makes no sense to them. An
accurate teacher solves that.


So to accurately follow the genesis tale of creation we need to be able to
read it in the original language and deal with redactions over the ages.
This must be quite a challenge. It's little wonder no two creationists
agree. So with the translations and other meddling the bible isn't going to
be much of a science text now even if it was accurate when written. And it
wasn't intended as a science text anyway.


More to the point of this thread why is it that an evangelical
minister couldn't accept theistic evolution and remain a minister?

As it is now, evolution is not correctly defined IMHO.

Wolf to dogs? Bacteria to a stronger form of bacteria? Graft one fruit
tree to another fruit tree, sure.Yes. That is 'each after their own kind'.

Fish to man? Ape to man? Fern to apple tree? Maybe in your dreams and
defiantly a speculation at best based on how one wants to judge the
evidence. I am of the opinion that if it does not line up with an accurate
interputation of God's word and other ancient texts regarding origins,
then it is probably incorrect. Or at least partially incorrect.



I don't know what your purpose is here. You spend so much time arguing
against evolution I would have expected you to know what I meant by it by
now. I see no reason in this context to revisit this doctrine of kinds.

Let me repeat the question slightly differently. In your study of the bible
what specifically was it that made you reject they idea that God used
evolution as a mechanism to arrive at the living world we see today?

David

.

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