Re: OT: Bad, bad ethanol

tgdenning@xxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

On Feb 13, 9:54 am, dkomo <dkomo...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

tgdenn...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

On Feb 12, 7:27 pm, Lee Jay <ljfin...@xxxxxxx> wrote:

On Feb 12, 5:12 pm, tgdenn...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

On Feb 12, 10:52 am, Lee Jay <ljfin...@xxxxxxx> wrote:

On Feb 12, 8:21 am, Jeffrey Turner <jtur...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Robert Carnegie wrote:
Agreed. Fossil fuels are the residue of billions of years of life on
Earth. At present, we go through at least the better part of a million
years worth of such per year. There's no way to replace that with a
year's production of corn, sugar and swichgrass. Not even close.

Have you tried working the math?

What exactly would the math tell us? That we can make an enormous
effort to achieve a trivial goal?

There is more than enough technology available to reduce consumption
of fossil fuels. Unless you can demonstrate that it is really, really
important that there be lots of people consuming as much as is
absolutely possible, the application of that technology is the
rational choice.

Energy efficiency is always a good idea, and is usually the best,
first approach. However, it is ultimately unsustainable by itself.
If you are utilizing finite non-renewable resources, you'll eventually
become supply-constrained like we are right now. If we had used
energy more efficiently over the last 100 years, we would have
delayed, but not eliminated that eventuality.

Except that if we had had a stable population over the last 100 years,
there would be no crisis of climate change, and there would be no
problems of liquid fuel supply. Sustainability would be a trivial
exercise with existing tech.

Up until now, we have been a r-selected species, instead of a K-selected
species. We still haven't reached the carrying capacity of our
environments in most places around the world.

Also, I've been looking around for examples of animal species that have
actually evolved an ability to *control* their reproductive rates to
prevent overcrowding, and have found virtually none. Almost all species
reproduce to their maximum capacities and let natural selection control
their numbers -- in the form of death. Death appears to be nature's
control process of choice.


Perhaps one of the experts can give examples, but I'm pretty sure that
conditions affect reproduction in a wide range of species.


Unless you deal with the issue of population as well as consumption,
you are still spitting into the wind, whether magic switchgrass exists
or not.

Apparently intelligence has not given us the ability to control our
reproductive rates up till now. We're just like all other animal
species on the planet.


No, intelligence has given us that ability, and more important the
ability to predict the nature of our environment into the future. If a
coyote (just guessing) has fewer pups because the season is dry and
there are fewer rabbits, she is responding to what may be a single
event but also perhaps a trend in local climate.

This is not an example of an animal controlling its reproduction rate. The coyote is *being* controlled by its environment. Taken to its logical conclusion, what if the coyote can't get enough food or water and simply dies? Then she doesn't have any pups at all!

We can do much better
than that.


Tis devoutly to be wished.

We are not like those other animals on the planet; we have nation-
states and politics, which is what keeps us from exercising our
ability to improve conditions for our offspring.


Which means we're territorial. Just like most of those other animals on the planet.


--dkomo@xxxxxxxx

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: OT: Bad, bad ethanol
    ... Fossil fuels are the residue of billions of years of life on ... Up until now, we have been a r-selected species, instead of a K-selected ... actually evolved an ability to *control* their reproductive rates to ... Apparently intelligence has not given us the ability to control our ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: OT: Bad, bad ethanol
    ... Fossil fuels are the residue of billions of years of life on ... Up until now, we have been a r-selected species, instead of a K-selected ... reproduce to their maximum capacities and let natural selection control ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: OT: Bad, bad ethanol
    ... Fossil fuels are the residue of billions of years of life on ... Also, I've been looking around for examples of animal species that have actually evolved an ability to *control* their reproductive rates to prevent overcrowding, and have found virtually none. ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: OT: Bad, bad ethanol
    ... actually evolved an ability to *control* their reproductive rates to ... reproduce to their maximum capacities and let natural selection control ... It requires a method to handle defectors that is species ... child policy is beginning to crack, because of the large number of ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Homo erectus, city dweller and sailor
    ... I have studied world history, human history, religions, philosophy, ... Thenthe instant ice age was followed up by a 19,000 year ... but what had become of the other species and ... against nature and a burning desire to control everything on the ...
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