Re: Core beliefs

On May 12, 7:32 pm, Zoe <muz...@xxxxxxx> wrote:
you know, I was pondering the mystery of why there could be two
equally educated, equally intelligent persons, Ph.D.s even, looking at
the same data, and one be convinced that the data is evidence for
intelligence and the other be equally convinced that the data is
evidence for evolution. And each looks at the other and considers the
other foolish for interpreting the data the way they do.

After some thought, it appears to me that, apparently, it is not the
data that convinces, but instead it is some preexisting core belief
that governs in what direction the data convinces.

The creationist views reason and rational thought as being outside of
nature. He sees that intelligence can be imposed upon nature to shape
and manipulate it and thus finds it easy to imagine that intelligence
has been imposed upon nature in the past, to organize it the way it
is.

The evolutionist views reason and rational thought to be emergent from
nature, that free will does not exist, and therefore, intelligence is
merely a product of nature and not a cause of nature.

Oh, and then there is a third person who is equally educated, equally
intelligent, who believes that God exists and is possibly good, but
who also cannot harmonize the injustices and suffering in the world
with such a possibly good God, so they straddle the fence and try to
believe in both God and evolution.

Do I have these positions pegged right? If not, I'll hear about it,
I'm sure.

Yet even these positions are not yet the core beliefs, I don't think.

I submit that the core belief of the creationist is that God exists
and is good.

The core belief of the evolutionist is that either god does not
exist, or if a god exists, he must be worthy of hate because why would
he let so much suffering exist, why would he make nature to be the way
it is, why is survival of the fittest all that seems to matter?

And as for the theistic evolutionist...well, he just goes back and
forth.

Therefore, arguing about the data gets us nowhere because our core
beliefs govern how we see the data. And nobody is addressing the core
beliefs.

I guess the real point of contact has to be WHY we have the core
beliefs that we have, and can they be justified.

I think I can justify my core belief. Can the evolutionist or the
theistic evolutionist justify his/her core belief?

you are only half right. creationists do have a core belief in which
they interpret all facts. scientists simply draw logical inferences
from the facts themselves. there is no core belief that scientists
adhere too when looking at facts. scientists only draw conclusions
that the facts themselves warrant. it just so happens that no facts
warrant the conclusion that any gods exist. too bad for gods.

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Core beliefs
    ... that governs in what direction the data convinces. ... He sees that intelligence can be imposed upon nature to shape ... with such a possibly good God, so they straddle the fence and try to ... Yet even these positions are not yet the core beliefs, ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Core beliefs
    ... that governs in what direction the data convinces. ... He sees that intelligence can be imposed upon nature to shape ... with such a possibly good God, so they straddle the fence and try to ... Yet even these positions are not yet the core beliefs, ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Core beliefs
    ... that governs in what direction the data convinces. ... among the creationist's core competencies. ... with such a possibly good God, so they straddle the fence and try to ... believe in both God and evolution. ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Core beliefs
    ... He sees that intelligence can be imposed upon nature to shape ... with such a possibly good God, so they straddle the fence and try to ... believe in both God and evolution. ... Yet even these positions are not yet the core beliefs, ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Core beliefs
    ... that governs in what direction the data convinces. ... He sees that intelligence can be imposed upon nature to shape ... believe in both God and evolution. ... Yet even these positions are not yet the core beliefs, ...
    (talk.origins)