Re: Thermodynamic vs. Informational Entropy - for Dr. Marc Buhler

"Perplexed in Peoria" <jimmenegay@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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"Deadrat" <a@xxxxx> wrote in message
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"Perplexed in Peoria" <jimmenegay@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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"Deadrat" <a@xxxxx> wrote in message
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"Perplexed in Peoria" <jimmenegay@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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"Deadrat" <a@xxxxx> wrote in message
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"Seanpit" <seanpitnospam@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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... The random-type order of heat energy simply isn't enough
to produce a particular function. He mentions that heat is
used all the time in heat combustion engines, so I'm
obviously wrong to say that heat energy, by itself, is
worthless when it comes to obtaining "useful" work. The
problem, obviously, is that without the order of the engine
itself, the specific arrangement of its parts, all being
there in just the right order, heat energy added to the mix
just won't do anything useful.

You're being too literal minded. All that's required for
useful work is a heat source and a cold sink.

I have to agree with Sean here.

Then you need to lie down until the feeling passes. Make sure
that you don't operate any heavy machinery.

You need things something like
pistons, valves, cams, shafts, etc. Even if you take the basic
hardware as given and claim that all of the 'information' for
extracting energy is in the cam, you still need something like
two to three bits of information in the cam to open the valves
at the right time, etc. Otherwise you don't get power out of
your heat source and cold sink.

Study a little thermodynamics before you start blathering on about
'information.'

I've done that. Now explain to me where I am wrong. Show me a
heat engine which still works if the order of the operations is
changed, or if the directionality of any "one-way-valves" is
reversed. I'm pretty sure it can't be done. The closest I've seen
is the work of Anthonie Muller on convection-driven engines for
producing chemical energy from enzymes in an abiogenesis context,
yet even here, a slight change in the specification of the enzymes
would make the system non-functional.

You do understand that the preceding paragraph is a complete non
sequitur, don't you?

Nope.


Information and entropy are related. The amount of information of a
system is the number of bits required to describe its microstate given
its macrostate. I don't think "'information' for extracting energy is in
the cam" means anything, but I'll admit I'm out of my depth.

Deadrat

.

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