Re: Vernacular and Linnaean Naming (Was: KT boundary event)


Alexander wrote:
UC wrote:
r norman wrote:
On 14 Jun 2006 14:01:23 -0700, "UC" <uraniumcommittee@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:


You understand NOTHING about language.

If all you care about is notions of meaning, of language, of
semiotics, or whatever related subject, then why are you toiling away
here in talk.origins? (OK, I know. You have been thrown out of all
other fora.)

The subject matter that is appropriate here is origins. More
specifically, it is evolutionary origins. Questions about
evolutionary relationships between dinosaurs and birds and between
dogs and wolves are most certainly appropriate. Questions about Eco
and vernacular and German translation and the like are distinctly off
topic. People here are not too fussy about topicality but have
already shown you far too much tolerance, in my opinion.

If you want to say "birds are dinosaurs" it shows you have no
understanding of how to communicate scientific information, whether you
like to hear that or not.

If you're talking about the communication of scientific information to
the general public you might have the glimmering of the begining of a
point. If you are saying the usage of phrases and expressions common
in the scientific community rarely translate well in the public domain
then I don't think many here would disagree.

All right, then.

The mis-application of
the word 'theory' is a better example of this - whether it's done
deliberately within the creationist camp or just casually in the media
the usage rarely coincides with the specific scientific application of
the term.

A splendid example. Of course, 'theory' ('Theorie') also has different
meanings in German, etc.


If you mean can scientists communicate clearly amongst themselves then
the answer is certainly yes.

I have little doubt of that.

The fact that they use specific meanings
and apply that meaning in a narrow fashion would only be a problem if
they then changed those understandings and definitions within the
community at random. As the scientific community relies on consistency
of evidence and interpretation of that evidence then this is rarely a
problem.

I'm not sure about this.

The fixation on 'birds are dinosaurs' is a minor issue and can be shown
how this is a useful shorthand for a more complex point that can be
examined through rigorous study. You have to start somewhere. 6 year
olds don't get told how you can do advanced maths by replacing numbers
with letters after all when all you initially need to understand is how
1 + 1 = 2.

I disagree, obviously. 6-year olds don't need, then, to be told "birds
are dinosaurs" at all, if they cannot understand it in more
sophisticated language.




Your communication skills are lacking. You want to know why a majority
of Americans don't accept Darwinism? Because of incompetent people like
you!


Well no. The large number of anti-evolutionists is down to religious
prejudice and a culture of anti-intellectualism in the US. A culture
more or less unique in the western world. Your obssession with
linguistics and Eco notwithstanding there is more to communication
processes than either the historicity of use and structuralist
application of the grammarian approach. You might benefit from reading
beyond semiology.


I offer you a solution to the problem, and you point your finger at me?
How quaint!

In fairness I don't believe an actual solution has been offered. I
don't see what exactly qualifies you to shout down the experts in their
fields purely on linguistic grounds either. Perhaps you'd care to
clarify what makes you such an authority (and why the only authority
you cite is Eco)?

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Vernacular and Linnaean Naming (Was: KT boundary event)
    ... If all you care about is notions of meaning, of language, of ... If you're talking about the communication of scientific information to ... As the scientific community relies on consistency ... Perhaps you'd care to ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Vernacular and Linnaean Naming (Was: KT boundary event)
    ... If you want to say "birds are dinosaurs" it shows you have no ... If you're talking about the communication of scientific information to ... If you mean can scientists communicate clearly amongst themselves then ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Universality as warrant for relative truth value
    ... If meaning is "what is in mind", ... We have a shared communication system. ... we are ignoring connections with reality. ... If you presume repeatability, then any ...
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  • Re: Vernacular and Linnaean Naming (Was: KT boundary event)
    ... If you're talking about the communication of scientific information to ... If you mean can scientists communicate clearly amongst themselves then ... The fixation on 'birds are dinosaurs' is a minor issue and can be shown ...
    (talk.origins)
  • Re: Vernacular and Linnaean Naming (Was: KT boundary event)
    ... If you're talking about the communication of scientific information to ... If you mean can scientists communicate clearly amongst themselves then ... The fixation on 'birds are dinosaurs' is a minor issue and can be shown ...
    (talk.origins)