Re: So, are there races of men?

Noone Inparticular wrote:

> John Harshman wrote:
>
>>Jeff wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Seems to me that there are some serious hypocrites in the scientific
>>>world. While they rightfully take apart believers (I am an atheist)
>>>for refusing to go where truth leads them where gods are concerned,
>>>they themselves allow egalitarians to claim that there are no races of
>>>men, with silly statements about race being a socially constructed
>>>idea. A scientist follows the truth WHEREVER IT MAY LEAD. If it
>>>leads to the conclusion that religion is a silly relic of the past,
>>>then that's where you go. If it leads to the conclusion that there
>>>are races of men who have different mental and physical abilities,
>>>then that's also where you should go. If you don't believe races
>>>exist, then show us the biological function in nature that would make
>>>sure equality is the rule. Nature doesn't care about equality. There
>>>are clearly white men and black men. Show us that function which
>>>would not allow for mental abilities to be different in isolated
>>>populations.
>>
>>The reason I find it hard to believe is that there's been too much gene
>>flow over time for such differences to be maintained by anything other
>>than selection. Skin color is an obvious target of selection in
>>different environments. I don't see the differences in environment that
>>would select for different intelligences, especially if we try to make
>>that difference one between Africa and the rest of the world.

> Not specifically related to this issue, but certainly traits that are
> not directly selected can be affected by other traits that *are*
> selected. Complex interactions between genes, biochemistry, development
> and such. That is, I should think. Do you?

Yes. There are two sorts of such interactions: genetic linkage and
pleiotropy. Genetic linkage is easy to break, and in the event of
selection for one linked trait and against the other, this should
usually happen quickly. Pleiotropy is not as fast, but again we would
expect modifier genes to eventually mitigate any deleterious effects. I
don't see a big change in what I said.

Simple isolation by distance can account for some of the differences
between widely separated populations too. But that doesn't make races,
or even steep clines.

.

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