Re: The basic problem I have with Intelligent Design


"Alfred A. Aburto Jr." <aburto@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:Wp3_e.3040$KQ5.1083@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > VBM wrote:
> > I have read some of the intelligent design materials and it seems to be
> > saying that what we have now is uniquely and amazingly well-suited to
fit,
> > well, the way things are now. "If X was even very slightly different, we
> > would not be able to live on this planet", etc, etc. This makes a very
large
> > logical fallacy: that this end product was a necessity.
> >
> > They start with the current state of things as if this state of things
was
> > the ultimate goal, and then work backwards to show that everything fits
what
> > we now have perfectly, and the ODDS of things turning out this way is so
> > tremendously low, that it MUST have come about by design. The whole
> > watchmaker argument.
> >
> > Even though I am a Christian and believe that God DID create everything,
I
> > have to admit that the entire ID argument just doesn't hold up logically
> > without a pre-existing belief. The presupposition is that the "current"
was
> > the "goal" (a position that is not self-evident, but a matter of belief,
and
> > a belief which I happen to hold, btw). The response is obviously that
> > everything fits because if it did not fit, we would not be here and,
here is
> > the kicker, SOMETHING ELSE WOULD BE HERE! At each stage of
possibilities,
> > something else could have happened and the universe would then fit THAT
> > instead of what we have now.
> >
> > What I mean is that whatever path the development of the universe took,
> > everything would fit that path or it wouldn't be there.
>
> This is all very well said and accurate!
>
> Personally, I think the ID people are just fooled, blinded, misguided,
> by the incredible scope of nature! An ant, for example, is orders of
> magnitude more complex than a watch or a flagellum, yet you can watch it
> form from this tiny egg all by itself! The right DNA and nutrients and
> there it goes! Fantastic! But not magic!
>
> The bigger questions for all scientists ought to be ... why does the
> universe, all the laws of nature, appear designed for life? The answer
> may be just as you stated above? If the universe is designed for life
> then it should be teeming with life already at all stages of
> development. Why then does the rest of the universe appear dead of life?
> Or are we just not looking closely enough? Surely this is a big part
> of the problem. We just don't have the level of technology and
> sensitivity of equipment to properly detect life elsewhere in the solar
> system, galaxy or universe. Is the Earth and the treasures it holds in
> its biological creatures unique in the universe? Are we really special,
> made by some god or godlike entity, even beyond the fact that the
> universe already appears designed for life?
>
> Great questions that will occupy scientists for centuries. It may even
> be that we might not be smart enough to solve the problem. The answer
> may need to await more advanced creatures we design and build ... who
> really knows what paths we'll take in the future ... we may even self
> distruct ...
>
> The ID folks need to take their blinders off and get down and start
> doing some science! Invoke God only if there is absolutely no
> alternative explanations (and this will never happen!). They (the ID
> disciples) short circuit the whole process of scientific inquiry because
> they have already decided that god did it! What fools are they.
>
> Well, anyway, I like what you wrote above ... :-)

Thanks, and I really see no need to "invoke" God to explain things science
can't at any given point. Rather, as a Christian, I think the point is to
invoke God in the "whole"! To see God in all of it. We Christians seem to
have no problem accepting that God is the ultimate force behind
photosynthesis, vulcanization, gravity and every other ongoing natural
processes, without requiring that He is "managing" these processes. We
accept that they happen randomly, according to a set of understandable
patterns boundaries. Why all of the sudden do Christians balk at God being
the force behind EVERY natural force in nature even though they happen
randomly? Why do we need to think that some processes are specifically
guided while all of the rest are not?

Now, this has nothing to do with the miraculous. God allowing natural
processes to happen randomly does NOT mean that God can not and does not
choose to directly intervene in a relational way with Mankind. But this
belief, so essential to Christianity, does NOT require that randomness is
impossible for the development of life.

.

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