Re: Proof there exists a soul

<manutter51@xxxxxxxxx> wrote

> Robert J. Kolker wrote:
> > manutter51@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
> > >
> > > Then why does theoretical physics ever correctly predict applied
> > > physics?
> >
> > Correct to within insturmental error. Remember that a human is reading
> > the dial and assigning meaning to the reading.
>
> No, I'm talking about opening up whole new areas of discovery, e.g.
> general and special relativity, quantum mechanics, and so on. These
> are areas that were predicted mathematically before they were verified
> empirically.

I'd hardly say so. Math was found that could be applied to certain problems.
But most of mathematics corresponds to absolutely nothing in nature.

> Even though the calculations themselves are not made of
> matter, they have turned out to correctly predict entire new fields of
> empirical observations previously unsuspected.

No prediction was involved. You are correct in that symbolic language has
meanings that are not material, but in some way represent states of affairs.
(Most everyone one who really thinks about this are physicalists, not
materialists. Matter doesn't actually exist, fields do.)

> > > can and do get wrong answers sometimes, which can be mathematically
> > > proven, later on, to be incorrect. The correctness of the solution is
> > > an intrinsic property of the coherence of mathematics as a whole, even
> > > though mathematics per se is not composed of matter.
> >
> > Mathematical proof is an operation performed on formal statements using
> > rules of inference applicable to formal statements. Proof exists in our
> > heads along with numbers.
>
> Yet there has to be more to it than mere subjective solipsism, because
> the results are non-arbitrary. The results of the sum 4+3 does not
> equal one total for me and a different total for you and a third total
> for someone else, nor is the derivative of 4x^3 +2x^2 one formula for
> me and a different formula for someone else, at least not if we're
> doing our math correctly. There is an *objective* reality to
> mathematics, despite the fact that mathematics is not made of matter,
> independent of who is doing the calculation.

I see you are a mathematical realist, but all this means is 1 does not equal
0 because of how 1 and 0 are defined. I agree with you that, for example,
"fiveness" exists in nature and is the set of all things that can be considered
5.

> In fact, you can program
> a machine to do the math--it does not have to happen inside a human
> head at all. There is more to *material* reality than just matter.
> The properties of matter are also real.

The abstract proofs are in human minds. You can program a machine to do
math incorrectly; it doesn't care. People do. All this means is clear thinking
is logically consistent.

My view is the world is simply orderly in a way that arithmetic is not totally
sufficient to describe it, but you rarely need to go beyond third order
derivatives in calculus.

--
Craig Franck
craig.franck@xxxxxxxxxxx
Cortland, NY

.

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