Re: Computer problem, need help
- From: El Castor <No_One@xxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 20:37:42 -0700
On Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:53:52 -0500, Glenn <minorgo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
On Wed, 8 Oct 2008 19:50:38 -0700 (PDT), mg <mgkelson@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
On Oct 8, 3:22 pm, Glenn <mino...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Wed, 8 Oct 2008 13:13:07 -0700 (PDT), mg <mgkel...@xxxxxxxxx>
I think you are overlooking some problems with the restore utilities
provided to computer buyers:
PROBLEMS WITH FACTORY REINSTALL DISC
If you reinstall from a factory disc, it wipes out any updates you
have installed on your OS drive. It also wipes out any additional
programs or drivers that you have installed since you bought the
computer. In addition, it wipes out any data, including music and
pictures that you might have on your hard drive. Factory restore discs
that rely on a separate partition on the hard drive obviously won't
work if the hard drive has been corrupted or quits working.
Your argument isn't valid without mentioning the failure mode while
defining the three levels of backup and recovery. First a user file
has been corrupted, use backup and restore. Second, a system file is
faulty, use system restore and possible backup and restore if the
system fault corrupted user data. Third, the manufactures image or
whatever was added before the first system checkpoint is faulty. Use
restore manager. If factory restore is on the hard disk, it's
probably there because the disks are mirrored, but if one is paranoid,
one can create a restore disk. I suspect that other than during the
first week of operation, a restore of the manufactures images
shouldn't happen, but if it does, it's due to incompetent diagnosis or
user error. System restore doesn't impact user files and the system
creates system only files early and often. I'm not going to explain
the theory behind checkpoints after fix or update install but it's at
the heart of all software recovery programs.
PROBLEMS WITH MICROSOFT'S RESTORE UTILITY
(1) The Microsoft restore utility only operates if you can get the
computer to boot.
(2) Microsoft's restore utility only goes back a limited period of
time. If the problem dates back beyond that you will not be able to
fix the problem.
(3) Sometimes Microsoft's restore utility doesn't work even if the
checkpoint is still available.
(4) I have had one case where Microsoft's restore utility actually
trashed the data on my hard drive.
1) I suggest f11 or a boot disc, but again it all depends on defining
the failure mode. If it's totally unresponsive, there's a hardware
problem and a different strategy is used.
This is to complicated for the average user and as I said before
Microsoft's System Restore utility isn't always reliable.
2) That's why I suggest periodically doing a manual create system
restore disc. Currently I have thirty restores without the need to
save one. Again, the problem escaped attention through thirty updates
or restores?
My system restore currently goes back about 3 months and it is very
possible that the problem(s) could occur before that and if they did
you are SOL. In addition, as I said before, System Restore doesn't
always work and my experience has been that the further back you go
the less likely it is to work. Even if it does work, you will lose all
the software installed since that date and all the Microsoft
updates.
3) The failure mode must first be defined before the strategy can be
faulted.
4) I have no idea, what did the MS technicians say. You did create a
trouble report, didn't you?
Calling Microsoft to solve a problem isn't a solution and even if you
do call them, there's no guaranty they'll be able to solve the
problem.
Finally, MS doesn't send their software and hardware technicians
through school and then give them on the job training just to be
second guessed by an amateur like you. If the strategy is faulty,
explain it to them, don't pretend that you are an expert in this area.
I was twenty years ago, but I don't tell MS how to do their job, I'm
just glad that they haven't got stuck in the past.
Microsoft does a pretty good job with their System Restore utility
given the fact that they are limited to only one hard drive, but their
System Restore utility doesn't always work. The solution is to use two
hard drives and a reliable backup utility like Ghost.
How do large corporations repair their employ's computers? I can tell
you that Intel, for instance, uses Norton Ghost. They don't mess
around calling Microsoft and they don't spend hours going through 30
restore set points and then hoping one of them will work.
I'll reluctantly have to say that the above version is somewhat
correct. I worked for a very large corporation, and we did make use of
hardware and software tech support contracts, but not to solve user
created problems -- pretty much only to solve problems we were having
in creating model workstations, or with SQL servers, file servers,
gateways, and networking, and even then, it was mainly to report, or
verify, bugs, but even then, tech support calls to Microsoft were a
last ditch desperation thing, and most often involved server crashes
and hardware issues. I often had occasion to talk to senior tech
support at Compaq, and I can recall one instance where I had to deal
with an actual partner at Kingston, but those were for generalized
server and workstation platform issues.
The reason we didn't ever to my recollection have to use restore
points, or a second hard drive for that matter, was that users didn't
have the rights needed to install their own software, and there really
were no restore points. They were given standardized workstations that
were designed to fit the needs of their department, and saved all
their data on a server. The servers were backed up, but their
workstations were not -- except for the standard workstation or laptop
images that resided on the server -- for which we used Ghost. If a
user required additional specialized software, we installed it for
them, but we discouraged that. The exception was really high end users
who maintained the bank's firewalls, web site, and the like. We would
help out with connectivity problems and set up the server end, if they
weren't using their own server, but otherwise they were on their own.
I'll say it again. You have only your experience, MS employs experts..
You haven't told MS that they are wrong and you are right so you have
no credibility for all your problems may have been user errors.
Intel provides the mirroring code, if they don't use it, then they
are an unreliable provider and HP needs to find another source. The
best way to produce robust code is for the programmers and engineers
to use their own product.
What's your background that gives credibility to your solution? I was
the IBM site software reliability representative. I saw all the
software and hardware problem data. I worked with our human factors
department to help reduce the number of user errors. I helped to
introduce serviceability features to help with problem isolation. You
have no standing. Your advice is worthless. If MS and I won't listen
to you, why should anyone?
Glenn
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