Re: French And CERN Build Massive Particle Accelerator (Black Hole Generator) Unknown Planetary Risk To Create Artificial BIG BANG

On May 14, 3:05 pm, Rumpelstiltskin
<PleaseDoNotReplyByEm...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Wed, 14 May 2008 11:43:45 -0700 (PDT),alGuacamole<a...@xxxxxxxx>
wrote:


At large dimensions a continuous force can have a continuous
explanation. For example, Maxwell's equations summarize the
experiments which do not depend on an ether to explain. Continuous EM
waves drop out of these equations. However, at quantum dimensions,
this continuous object is better represented as a photon exchange.

But, as you note, we haven't detected any such exchange
in the case of "gravitons', or the "gravitons". This is not a
case of recognizing particles. It's a case of finding particles
that are supposed to be responsible for forces. That is
different, and there's a very long way to go yet IMV.

I think that we agree here. There may be a lot of theories about
space. But until the gravitational changes to space are explained at
the quantum level and verified by experiment, the theory is still
unfinished.

This is a duality of view on the same EM wave. To describe it's
behavior in interacting with a lens requires it to be a continuous
wave. To describe it's behavior in the photoelectric effect or at an
atomic level requires it to be a photon. We need to do the same thing
with the gravitational field at a quantum level.

Mmm, as far as I know, the photoelectric effect is specifically
about particles under sway of the electromagnetic force, not
about the electromagnetic force itself..

IIRC a particle of light represented by a photon is absorbed by an
electron and hence is kicked out of the solid. The explanation of the
electron absorbing the energy from a continuous light wave just does
not work. On a macroscopic level, light is an electromagnetic "force".
On a quantum level it is a photon with momentum and energy.

Yes. The ether has just been proved by experiment not to exist beyond
a certain level.

I just showed that it hasn't. The ether in the old sense
(with reference to velocity only) has been disproved, not
just beyond a certain level but there's no need for it at all
in the old sense.

I could have called "the ether" in the sense of
acceleration something other than "the ether", I suppose,
but I see no need to do so and I do think the analogy is
very apropos. As I noted, the only difference is bumping
it to a higher (call it "lower" if you want) derivative level.

So I guess we agree that the ether is not needed to propagate light.
Nevertheless, I'm amazed at how angular momentum can be transferred
back an forth without a sensation of that happening. I noticed that at
a science museum. Holding a bicycle wheel rotating starts me rotating
about a vertical axis as I rotate the wheel from a vertical to a
horizontal axis. There after, the momentum seems to shift back and
forth between me and the wheel. Weird.

I don't find that so problematic myself. Conservation of
angular momentum is just an aspect of inertia. I was trying
to think of an analogy with regular momentum, but I can't
think of a good one.

The best I could come up with is too artificial to be clear.
Imagine a ten pound rocket moving at ten miles a second
with respect to the ground. Now jettison five pounds of
the rocket to the ground at ground speed so that it falls
straight to the ground and doesn't skid or skip. The
remainder of the rocket would have to move at twenty miles
a second to conserve linear momentum. The reason that's
not a very clear analogy is that from the standpoint of the
rocket, you'd have to jettison the material backwards at five
pounds per second in order for the jettison to be zero with
respect to the ground. That backwards jettison creates an
equal-and-opposite computation in the speed of the
remainder, of course. So even though it is the same thing,
it's not parallel enough to be clear. The reason I can't come
up with a simpler analogy is that in the angular momentum
experiment, nothing gets discarded, it just gets moved into
a place where the same amount of mass doesn't move as
far at the same angular speed, so it has to spin at a different
rate to preserve the same mass-times-velocity.. There's no
way to do the same thing without discarding something for
an object moving linearly.

The typical explanation of linear momentum experiments are collisions.
It's quite intuitive. but I feel no transfer of angular momentum
through my arms to the spinning wheel so I have a difficult time
seeing how the phenomena is working.
.

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