Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- From: Alan Lichtenstein <arl@xxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 17:08:08 -0400
Thumper wrote:
On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 11:23:19 -0700, El Castor <NotAnyone@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Thumper <jaylsmith@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 14:06:46 GMT, Rita <nitany_98@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:46:15 -0400, Alan Lichtenstein <arl@xxxxxxx>
wrote:
Rita wrote:
On Tue, 08 Aug 2006 16:03:54 -0400, Alan Lichtenstein <arl@xxxxxxx>
wrote:
Rita wrote:
On Tue, 08 Aug 2006 10:49:36 -0700, El Castor <NotAnyone@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Jean Smith <gotermite@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article <BbudnY3mU_HhGkrZnZ2dnUVZ_tCdnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxxxx>,
El Castor <NotAnyone@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Jean Smith <gotermite@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article <d6WdnQEYQ_Zjf0vZnZ2dnUVZ_sqdnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxxxx>,
El Castor <NotAnyone@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Alvin Toda <aet@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Sat, 05 Aug 2006 13:08:57 -0400, Josh Rosenbluth
<jrosenbluth@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Alvin Toda wrote:
Why try to narrow the scope of this discussion until it is irelavant?
Diplomats OTOH try to see it from a mile up where they can see the
forest and not just the trees. Rejecting the wider discussion out of
hand is foolish and dangerous.
There is no wider discussion to have with Hezbollah because they have want to discuss only one thing (existence of Israel).
Josh Rosenbluth
That's a silly excuse for not addressing the reason for the conflict.
What is the reason for the conflict? The existence of Israel? How does
Israel negotiate it's own existence?
That wasn't the reason. Arab prisoners in Israel's custody was the reason for the offer of a prisoner exchange. Israeli occupation of Shebaa Farms is the reason given for Hezbulah's continued interest in Israel. The Lebanese give Hezbulah credit for Lebanon's existance as an independent country. It's what they do.
If you really believe that, then you are even more foolish, naive, and
despicable than I had assumed. Jean, there will always be a murderer
to be released, or a land dispute (which by the way is between Syria
and Lebanon) to be settled. Those are just the latest excuses.
All the moves toward peace depend on Hezbulah acting as a loyal agent of Lebanon rather than the robot of Iran and Syria. We'll see shortly. From my point of view Hezbulah is representing the interests of Lebanon. The Lebanese from the government down claim this view. The Lebanese is unanimous in wanting to send 15,000 Lebanese Army soldiers into South Lebanon. Hezbulah is part of that. Tell me how your theory is working.
Hezbollah is armed and financed by Iran. Cash contributions alone
total $100 million - $200 million a year. Hezbollah's rockets,
mortars, small arms, anti-tank weapons, and the silkworm missile they
used against an Israeli ship -- supplied by Iran, and it's all
financed with oil money. Did you think Lebanese farmers chipped in and
bought that silkworm? One of the Hezbollah kidnappers of the two
Israeli soldiers has been captured, is talking, and was put on
television. He was trained in Iran. Iranian engineers designed the
concrete bunkers constructed by Hezbollah in southern Lebanon.
Hezbollah's Shiites are loyal to Iran, as are the Shiites of Southern
Lebanon. Why is that? Iran is the wealthy guardian of the Shia faith
-- not the Sunnis and Christians of Central and Southern Lebanon.
As for the 15,000 Lebanese soldiers who are proposed to occupy
Southern Lebanon, they are a joke. Half will be members of Hezbollah.
They will be "backed up" by 2,000 UN observers -- the same observers
who stood by for years while Hezbollah built their bunkers and trucks
carrying thousands of rockets and other armaments rolled across the
Syrian border. The same process will continue until and unless a
strong international force occupies Southern Lebanon.
I thought the proposal was not to have Lebanese forces occupy
Southern Lebanon permanently but only until a UN force could
replace it. There are no guarantees but if such a plan could stop
the killing on both sides, is it not worth trying? If you don't
agree, how do you think the conflict will be ended? Or don't
you want it to end? From what I've read, almost no one thinks
Hezbollah can be totally destroyed as a force in the Middle East.
Your wishful thinking and good intentions cause the problem to be clouded in your eyes. The goal is NOT to stop the killing, but to achieve a PERMANENT cessation of killing. As Jeff has said, the lebanese Army may very well be half Hezbollah. The only reason why the Lebanese want their army in there is so that in the interim, Hezbollah can be resupplied through Syria. Agreements are a joke, as far as they are concerned. Israel has taken the only action necessary. If the Lebanese want the killing to stop, they need only to agree to disarm Hezbollah and stop permitting them to hide among their civilian population.
It may be unfortunate that more people need to die, but the problem must be solved once and for all. It is most short-sighted to look only at the killing and ignore the reasons for that killing. After all, the killing occurs because of reasons. That is the error that you and other bleeding hearts make. If Hezbollah was so concerned about the poor downtrodden Lebanese civilians, they would mount their weapons far from civilian areas, instead of in suburbs, hospitals, apartment complexes, as they have been doing. You find it convenient to ignore that.
The problem will not be solved once and for all.
That being your position, then there is no profit in a cease fire, since all it does is return to the status quo ante, which guarantees future attacks and civilian deaths, periodically, ad infinitum. If that is your position, then you are placed in the position of supporting continued warfare with continued and never ending deaths. Don't you see the contradiction?
But if you wish to
think that Israel can wipe Hezbollah off the face of the earth, I
guess we will have to see what happens, won't we?
Apparently Israel thinks so as well. And that just galls a lot of you, doesn't it?
Do you think your posts have changed any minds? I guess they are
something you feel you must do as an impassioned partisan for
Israel through thick and thin. You have a strong emotional investment
in Israel and so of course you must support it. If it did a 180
degree turn tomorrow you would support that. No matter what, you
will support Israel's view and all of its actions.
Unfortunately Alan has the serious mental problem of calling people
stupid and other demeaning names when they don't agree with him. I'm
tired of it and won't put up with his crap any more.
Thumper
LOL -- an interesting statement coming from the most foul mouthed
member of this group.
Fuck you. I don't call people stupid or try to belittle them.
Whatsamatter, Thumper? What problem do YOU have that you have to resort to gutter language every time someone disagrees with YOU?
Ever hear the saying that people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones?
.
- References:
- Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- From: Alan Lichtenstein
- Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- From: Rita
- Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- From: Alan Lichtenstein
- Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- From: Rita
- Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- From: Thumper
- Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- From: Thumper
- Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- Prev by Date: Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- Next by Date: Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- Previous by thread: Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- Next by thread: Re: Is Israel Invincible?
- Index(es):
Relevant Pages
|
