Re: Question

On Wed, 31 May 2006 11:21:31 -0400, "George Z. Bush"
<georgezbush@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Rita wrote:
On Wed, 31 May 2006 07:24:55 -0400, "George Z. Bush"
<georgezbush@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

jimstevens wrote:
On Tue, 30 May 2006 21:08:22 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
<Waynelund@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


"Jerry Okamura" <okamuraj005@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:bf1fg.59$Ah.46@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
As I listen to the debate about what to do about the illegal
immigration
problem, it seems to me a basic question is, should the government
always
give us what we think we want. I think the answer is NO, they should
not.
They should give us what we think we want, when what we want is the
right
thing to do.

The trouble with all this illegal immigration BS is that neither the
media
nor the Washington nor the majority of the public have a clue. From
living
with Mexicans most of my life I can honestly say that the vast majority
of
Mexicans coming to the US are not in search of citizenship! They want
to
make some money, go home, get married, open a business. They use their
work
in the US to create their nest-egg. They don't want to become Americans
and
for the most part pay taxes and SS they will never get.

Amen!


They don't pay taxes. They claim a dozen dependents so have nothing
deducted from their wages. The lie that they pay taxes is told and
needs to be challenged.


Instead of all of this stereotyping, why don't we stipulate that those of
them who do pay taxes are entitled to receive the benefits that American
citizens who pay those taxes get as a matter of right?

It might also be a way to channel the argument if we identify the taxes
we're talking about; You surely don't mean all taxes because everybody
pays
sales taxes when they buy just the necessities of life. If you're
talking
about income taxes, lots of low income Americans don't pay them either,
so
what's new? If you're talking SS taxes, anyone who doesn't put the
minimum
in isn't going to get anything out at the end, and it doesn't matter if
they're an illegal Mexican or a native born American Indian.

George Z

The latter statement is not exactly the case, George. Citizens who
don't pay enough into SS to receive retirement benefits can apply for
SSI, which, if they are extremely low income and low asset folks (no
more than $2,000),
can receive something like $500 a month in retirement income from
the government. Not from the Social Security fund, however, but
from the U.S. general fund wihich Congress can authorize or change..
SSI also supplements a Social Security payment under that amount for
those who do qualify but receive very small monthly benefits.

Since I'm admittedly not knowledgeable about very much of the Social
Security program, I have no problem with accepting your statement as an
accurate description of the realities. That said, can we assume that those
circumstances were what Congress had in mind when they placed them in the
coverage provided by that program as a matter of public policy, or is it one
of those ubiquitous "unforeseen consequences" that our current president is
so fond of referring to?

I don't know whether or not any in Congress took this into
consideration. SSI is not an entitlement like Social Security in that
it really is government welfare. The rules on who can receive it can
change at the will of Congress. That happened in 1996 when legal
immigrants (green card holders) were barred from receiving it unless
they had worked and paid into regular Social Security for 40 quarters.

IOW, if we intended to provide minimum financial maintenance for illegal
Canadians and illegal Brits down on their luck in our country, doesn't it
stand to reason that we ought to have known that we'd be giving that same
degree of support to illegal Mexicans and Guatemalans, and Hondurans, etc.?
If so, what's the bitch?

Illegals can't receive SSI. As I said above, only citizens can and a
few categories of legal immigrants such as refugees. Other legal
immigrants can receive it only is they have worked in the U.S. and
paid into Social Security for 40 quarters.

I realize many don't know about SSI -- it is basically a minimum
safety net the government provides to citizens who for one reason or
the other reached age 65 without paying into Social Security or paying
enough to give them a bare bones income. Once a person becomes
a citizen, that person qualifies in the same manner as native born
citizens. Whether or not Congress could change that, however, if it
chose to, I don't know. Possibly it could. A Senator proposed that
illegals who becaame citizens not be allowed to receive the Earned
Income Tax credit.classes of citizens. What the unintended side
effects of such a change in policy would be? There always do seem
to be some to any legislation.
.

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