Re: Robin Cook: Adulterer

In article <jG6Le.4646$wh6.3358@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist <nospamatall@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>"Ian Davis" <ijdavis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>news:ddiqja$fg0$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Either Satan is real and his name is not wisely invoked, or he
>> is my myth which words can give life too, merely through the harm such
>> words can do. I believe in good and evil, and the entreaties of the good
>> will not stop me from opposing that which I perceive to be evil.
>
>Ian, Satan is an actual Hebrew word, meaning in English: :An opponent: An
>Adversary:
>
>The word "devil" has been used as a translation for two entirely different
>Greek words diabolos and daimon. The first word is found in those verses
>used to prove the so-called existence of some superhuman devil. Yet actually
>as a word, it signifies "adversary". "Traducer". "false accuser".
>"slanderer".
>
>Though it has generally translated "devil" it is also rendered "slanderers"
>(1 Timothy 3v11) and "false accusers" (2 Tim. 3v3; Titus 2v3). In no
>instance does it relate to a fallen angel, as a careful consideration of the
>passages will show.
>
> Daimonion is likewise translated "devil" but signifies "demon". It is an
>entirely different word to diabolos, and is used to describe a person
>possessed with a disease. The word is often properly translated in this way,
>in certain Bible passages, but belief in some supernatural devil caused
>biased translators to render it as Satan in other parts of the Bible.
>
>As has been pointed out that there are two Greek words translated "Devil"
>the second of which is the word diamonion. Parkhurst, in his Greek Lexicon,
>states that this word signifies "A lesser god, the spirit of departed human
>beings who had power to possess a person and so afflict him".
>
>The word was born of superstition, a superstition still current among
>ignorant people. Some backwoods people still believe that certain kinds of
>illnesses are due to the malignant influence of the spirit of departed
>human beings, taking possession of the afflicted person.
>
>In some eastern countries, the same idea persists, and doctors find that
>their use of modern scientific methods are often useless unless the
>hypothetical "devil" the creation of the imagination and superstition, is
>first "destroyed" or "cast out". It is not unusual for modern medical men in
>the East to thus speak, in all seriousness, of "casting out a devil" when
>referring to the healing of such an afflicted person.
>
>They accommodate their description to an expression which conveys something
>of the mind of the natives. Norman Lewis in a book on Burma entitled 'Golden
>Earth' records that such ideas are common among the Burmese.
>
>The Bible therefore, in using such terms as "casting out devils" merely
>accommodated its expressions to the current vernacular. To "cast out a
>devil" was to cure an illness. Thus such expressions occur as "Jesus
>rebukes the devil...and the child was cured" Matthew 17v18.
>
> Indeed, we read of one being cured of his epileptic fits by the Lord. Now
>if such a disease is really "A demon" how do pills and drugs control such a
>supernatural being today?
>
>Usually, the term "possessed of a devil" has relation to mental diseases.
>For example, when Jesus asked the Jews: "Why go ye about to kill me?" They
>replied: "You have a devil (Daimonion)," is equivalent to the modern
>expression: "You are mad!" Though the disciples used the term Daimonion,
>it does not mean they endorsed the pagan idea of the souls of departed men
>inhabiting those on earth, anymore then we endorse the literal meanings of
>words that have a colloquial significance.
>
>For example, the word "lunatic" signifies "affected by the moon" but when we
>use it we do not have that actual meaning in mind. We can speak of
>'pandemonium' breaking out when disorder takes place, but we do not endorse
>the literal meaning of the word which signifies that the disorder is due to
>the malignant influence of demons.
>
>We talk of someone being "bewitched" without believing in witches. We make
>reference to "St. Vitus Dance" without heeding the actual meaning of the
>term.
>
>So with the use of the word Daimonion. It is used colloquially by the Jews
>to describe one "possessed" by a disease. Christ used the language of his
>day, without necessarily accepting the superstitions involved.
>
>He made reference to "Beelzebub", the god of the flies worshipped by the
>Philistines of Ekron, as though this god had a living personality (Matthew
>12v27) merely to turn a point of discussion back upon his opponents.
>
> He certainly did not endorse the belief the god was a real living being.
>James 1v14 describes the real 'Adversary' in all of us (sinful human nature)
>perfectly:
>
>."But every man is tempted, WHEN HE IS DRAWN AWAY OF HIS OWN LUST AND
>ENTICED. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin, and sin, when
>it is finished, bringeth forth death".
>
>The Lord Jesus was himself very plain about this, for we read in Mark 7v20:
>"For FROM WITHIN, OUT OF THE HEART (human nature) OF MEN proceed EVIL
>THOUGHTS (no need here of any alleged extraneous tempter) adulteries,
>lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride foolishness. ALL THESE THINGS
>COME FROM WITHIN, AND DEFILE MEN/WOMEN".
>
>Matthew 15v19+ is in the same vane. And again we read:
>"The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can
>know it? I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every
>man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings". Jer
>17:10.
>
> Or as Jesus infers, human nature and its unlawful desires, leading to
>disobedience to God's commandments. This is the true enemy of Men and Women.
>This is what Jesus came to destroy even in himself.
>"For he was tempted in every way like unto his brethren YET WITHOUT SIN".
>Hebrews 4:15
> For he never gave in, to human unlawful desires or thoughts. This is
>described as "Destroying the works of the devil" 1 John 3v8.
>
> Hebrews 2v14-18 puts it into a nutshell, so to speak..
>"Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he
>(Jesus) also took part of the same, that through (his) death he might
>destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the *devil (see footnote).
>
> Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren,
>that he might be merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to
>God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. For in that being
>tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.".
>
>Jesus then overcame the "Human nature" within himself by refusing to submit
>to its temptations overcoming the "Devil" and the "Satan" within himself,
>and then finally defeating their works, once and for all, when he submitted
>his body to death by crucifixion and the sacrifice of himself..
>
>Jesus' sacrifice then illustrates the way in which we can conquer the
>"Devil" and "Satan". We SIN and are in need of forgiveness, and this is
>obtainable in Christ Jesus.
>
>Thus the Apostle Peter exhorted when preaching the Gospel:
>"Repent and be baptised everyone of you in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ
>for the remission of sins" (Acts 2v38).
>
>By believing in, and the "putting on of Christ" by baptism, we take the
>first steps in defeating the "Devil". For in Christ only can we receive
>forgiveness of our sins. John wrote:
> "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins,
>and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness" 1 John 1v19.
>
>Immortal life in the kingdom of God shortly to be set up on the earth
>(Daniel 2v44) is the hope set before us. To attain unto it we must conquer
>the "Devil" or the promptings of our human nature within each and everyone
>of us. The next step to that end is a proper and true understanding of the
>purpose of God in Christ, including his conquest of the devil.
>
>Having now properly identified the "Devil" and "Satan", man's true
>"Adversary" is then, his own unlawful desires (James 1v12-15: Matt.
>15v19)and his personal disobedience to his creators will. A perfect example
>of this is when Jesus called Peter 'Satan' (Adversary) when he tried to
>persuade Christ to by-pass his crucifixion .
>
> "From then on Jesus began to speak plainly to his disciples about going to
>Jerusalem, and what would happen to him there--that he would suffer at the
>hands of the Jewish leaders, that he would be killed, and that three days
>later he would be raised to life again. But Peter took him aside to
>remonstrate with him. "Heaven forbid, sir," he said. "This is not going to
>happen to you!" Jesus turned on Peter and said, "Get away from me, you
>Satan! You are a dangerous trap to me. You are thinking merely from a human
>point of view, and not from God's"." Matt. 16:21+ (L.B.)
>
>Now understanding these things properly, one is far better fitted to
>grapple with the problem of the sin "which does so easily beset us"
>Blaming ourselves for our sins, and not some figment of a past
>superstitious bias translator of the Scriptures.
>
> Jeff...
>"16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in
>doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee."
> 1 Tim 4:16 (KJV)

Thanks Jeff for your detailed position on the issue at hand. My rational
being doesn't believe in either God's or Devil's but emotively I am much
more afraid of the harm that a projected Devil can do us, than hopeful for
any good that a projected God can do us. You speak of superstition as if it
might be treated as a thing which was not, but it is very much a thing that is.
As you have said, a persons faith in superstition can kill him/her, and it
can save him/her. I didn't know you well enough to know what harm the
accusations levelled against you might do you. Some people on this newsgroup
would take accusations against their faith very much to heart, and it is
with some relief that I find you not so easily distracted, hurt or incensed
by such accusations. In that you show a steadfastness of which I spoke
earlier. Ultimately I believe learning comes from within, not from without.
I think we should be quick to lift others up, and slow to put others down.
A universe in which everything is couched in religious terms is actually a
very alien one to me -- it often seems a very American way of talking about
reality and I am not an American. Perhaps precisely because it is so alien,
it holds a strange fascination for me.

Strangely I would perhaps take the accusation that Satan spoke through me more
to heart than you appear to. I have no compass to trust but my own, and I
would be just a tad discombobulated at the accusation that my compass didn't
know true north from true south. It may often be off, but I'd trust that it
was not that far off, before I trust another who claimed that it was.

Ian

http://www.cs.rice.edu/~ssiyer/minstrels/poems/1204.html
.

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