Re: EXCOMMUNICATION - What are the reasons?


"Radial" <radisha00@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:11ojq1a73bfla20@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> As far as I am aware Mormons are opposed to smoking, drinking alcohol
> and caffeine based products (coffee, coca cola, etc) and drugs. I am
> guessing these actions are not grounds for excommunication because
> nobody has mentioned them as reasons. Do these actions provide grounds
> for disfellowship instead, in the Mormon church? What action is taken?

Which "Mormons" are you considering here? The Church of Jesus Christ of
Latter-day Saints have a revelation contained in Section 89 of Doctrine and
Covenants, which tells us that tobacco has some proper uses, (I am not sure
man has really learned to use it in that way) and that man is not to use
strong drink. Here are the pertinent portions. (You can read the whole thing
on line at www.lds.org . In fact you can read all our Standard Works
[Scriptures] there)

Quote
5 That inasmuch as any man drinketh wine or strong drink among you, behold
it is not good, neither meet in the sight of your Father, only in assembling
yourselves together to offer up your sacraments before him.
6 And, behold, this should be wine, yea, pure wine of the grape of the
vine, of your own make.
7 And, again, strong drinks are not for the belly, but for the washing of
your bodies.
8 And again, tobacco is not for the body, neither for the belly, and is not
good for man, but is an herb for bruises and all sick cattle, to be used
with judgment and skill.
9 And again, hot drinks are not for the body or belly.
End Quote.

Originally this revelation was not given by commandment, and so far as I
know, that has not changed, but several years ago in a conference, those
attending agreed (we are told) that they would accept the advice as if it
were a commandment. After all, if God is as wise as we believe, and tells us
it is not good for us to do some things, then would it be wise to say,
"Maybe so, but we prefer to do them anyway"?

Now the reason this revelation was given is stated in it.

Quote
4 Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of evils and
designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last
days, I have warned you, and forewarn you, by giving unto you this word of
wisdom by revelation--
End Quote

It certainly does not appear that there are fewer conspiring men now than
there were then, or that the evils and designs which they may plan have
lessened, does it? So if it was good advice then, do you suppose it is not
good advice now? We have even more knowledge now of the kinds of disease and
other evils can result from unwise use of alcohol and tobacco, at least. As
for hot drinks, well, of course some people are unwise enough to take very
hot coffee from (let us just say) McDonald's and spill it on themselves. <G>
But very shortly after the revelation was given, the leaders of the Church
at the time said it included coffee and tea which were commonly used at the
time. Apparently they never have included anything else. So to say that
"Mormons" are opposed to caffeine based products is not accurate. I am asked
on occasion (for example when I renew my Temple Recommend every two years)
whether I observe the Word of Wisdom. With a clear conscience I say yes, I
do, even though on occasion I drink a regular Coke or other cola. At home,
or elsewhere when available, I usually drink the sugar free, caffeine free
kind, regardless of brand. Is that wise? I don't know. I avoid coffee and
tea and their substitutes or decaffeinated kinds, but not slavishly. I
really can't tell much difference between tea and water. I used to think I
could, but a few years ago, while in a conversation I picked up a glass near
my hand and took a drink I detected something different and it was my
Mother's glass of iced tea. She no longer used sugar so it tasted slightly
different from water, but not enough that I preferred it at all.

We oppose the use of illegal drugs, because we can see what their use does
to families and individuals, as well as because we believe in general in
honoring and supporting the laws. (I said "in general") We think that
injudicious use of legal drugs is not wise, as well. But I take something
like 18 prescribed pills per day for various causes that may have resulted
from actions I took before I knew better (as a Protestant or a Baptist) BTW,
at the time I was a Baptist, the Baptists I knew could not live without
strong coffee. That is when and where I picked up the habit. I had drunk a
little coffee with meals prior to that, but after a little while you could
hardly find me without a nearby cup of coffee. I experienced what happens
when you drink without moderation. I did not like it. So I cut down some,
but still sometimes went overboard.

Excessive use of alcohol or drugs, of course, could lead to other actions
which would cause Disciplinary action. Possibly just the use of illegal
drugs, especially after other action had been taken, could lead to formal
action, maybe even Excommunication, but in my opinion, Disfellowshipment
would be a more likely first step, unless the person was in open defiance of
the Church.

Members are seldom (in my own experience never) subjected to Church
Discipline for use of alcohol or tobacco so long as not criminal actions
result. But they are not eligible for a Temple recommend in most cases.
Illegal drug users are unlikely, I think, to desire a Temple Recommend. Of
course we believe that the Temple is or should be the goal of all Latter-day
Saints. Not all the blessings of membership are available without the
Temple.

.

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