Re: Improving Boys' Verbal Performances



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In article <1155164999.694029.291420@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
"Hyerdahl" <Hyerdahl3@xxxxxxx> wrote:



Deborah Terreson wrote:
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In article <1155047047.066880.119600@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
"Hyerdahl" <Hyerdahl3@xxxxxxx> wrote:



ddnoe@xxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
Improving Boys' Verbal Performances
August 08, 2006
Vox Populi
By Denise Noe

Ever since the abilities of school-age children have been measured by
standardized tests, girls have scored higher than boys on verbal
ability and boys have outperformed girls in math.

The poor performance of females in math was alarming to many people.
After all, ours is an increasingly technological world in which people
without math skills are often left economically behind as well as
simply baffled. Why did so many girls and women appear to possess poor
math ability? Several well-done studies pointed to biological
differences between the genders. Boys and men appeared to have a
"math edge" due to genetics, hormones, and/or brain structure.

[Isn't this the approach Summers took, just before he was canned?
There are no credible studies showing that women can't do math. There
are no credible studies showing a huge difference in the way women's
and men's brains work. There are no studies at all showing that
hormones prevent women from doing math. There are no studies showing
that genetics has anything to do with math skills. What we DO have IS
the reality that the brains of women and men are much, much more alike
than different, and that the few differences that DO exist are
peripheral, having nothing to do with preventing one sex or the other
from equal accomplishments.]

Parg, you miss the point: Girls. don't. like. to. do. math.

I'll give that information to the women and girls who do "like" to do
math. Are you then suggesting that boys don't like to read and write?
:-)

Given the drippy emotional twaddle and sanitized, girl-safe drivel that
school districts make them read today, NO they don't, and I don't blame them
a bit.


They'd rather play 'make-up' or with dolls or engage in emotional-based
activities to such a degree that it *does* become a form of socialization.

When my neice graduated as a doctor of chemistry, I bought her a Barbie
Doll; does that count? :-)

Why on God's earth would you get such a ghastly, useless toy for a girl?
Have you ever noticed that Barbie is incapable of standing on her own two
feet? Now let's talk about the subtle psychological implications of that!

Take your insistence that I am a man, for example, to realize that yes,
women CAN do these things, but it WILL give them a much more logic-oriented
approach and view of the world, directly at odds with the views of *most*
'average' women (like yourself) today..

I most assuredly think you are a man.

...and most assuredly, this is a brilliant example of just how profoundly
*wrong* you are.. almost ALL of the time.

I take great pleasure in this fact about you. ;)

But that has nothing to do with
this topic, which is now that what one woman does or does not choose to
do, does not affect what another woman does or does not choose to do.
You see, social choices are not quite the same as civil rights.

What does civil rights have to do with helping boys improve their reading
and writing skills?


However, the possibility of a biological element in men's
mathematical superiority does not mean that women's ability in this
area is immune to improvement. In the last couple of decades, efforts
have been made to help females develop better math skills. Although
their performance in this area still does not equal that of boys, girls
have made splendid strides.

[Taking sexism out of the classroom is what has helped girls perform
well in math. There is no sexism in the classroom directed against
boys, at least none that has been proven or brought to light. And I
have not personally observed any sexism directed at boys. Also, girls
tend to learn in more cooperative ways and cooperation in the classroom
has, possibly lead to improvement for girls. If girls feel oppressed
by the cultural expectations between boys and girls they may not
perform as well, but when these expectations are eliminated in the
classroom, girls perform better.]

The very nature of sitting and learning 'quietly' while some dry, droll
sonorous 'instructor' parades out dry facts and ordinata in a benighted
attempt to 'teach' is blatantly sexist against boys.

That is what boys DID in all boy only schools, prior to girls being
admitted. In fact, the school day back in merry old England was longer
than our school day with more book learning. Also, back then boys had
to learn LATIN the dead language. :-) Talk about "droll".

Actually, I took Latin in 7th grade. It is the root of French, Italian and
Spanish, my dear and vastly improves the ability to master those tongues. In
a globalized economy, multiple language skills aren't such a bad idea, n'est
ce pas?

Who'd YOU rather trust> as an architect, the person who actually
planned and built a structure and> had that learning based in a
hands-on action oriented learning environment,
or someone who drew up plans with NO practical knowledge of construction or
design based on real world experience and education?

I don't see how this would be any different for girls. They also learn
more from actually doing the work than by reading about it. But again,
do you _really_ believe that in the good old days before schools were
coed, that boys learned architecture by building it or by drafting it?
Keep in mind the expense of building materials. :-)

Hon, the voc-ed department in the school district I graduated from actually
*built* houses - they're all over the Dover area.

And how would
you teach boys a language? Take them to the country of learning? :-)

Why not? Never hurt to travel. Well, terrorist plots notwithstanding, but
you don't need a plane ticket to get to Quebec to experience a bit of
French, or Mexico for a bit of Spanish..

You'd go for the book learned, and get taken, like most do, to the cleaners.

Again, book learning generally comes BEFORE application.

Hmmm. For some things. For others, there are these things called
'apprenticeships' where you go out into the field and actually learn
hands-on, the rudiments. THEN you go into the class and learn the science
behind the application so the numbers have relevance to the action.

You'd be an
utter moron to tell a clueless person to go build a structure without
education or written design. Why do you think architects learn to
draft blueprints?

*LOL* I can tell you've never tangled with an architect that doesn't know
flow patterns or practical plumbing or electrical planning. Parg, I was
studying to be an architect when a chance conversation with a master
carpenter who'd spent many years re-habbing poorly designed homes drawn out
by book-leanred twits who'd never picked up a hammer in their lives turned
me around. Straight up, it's why I went to work instead - to *learn* the
right way, based on real-world application - then the 80's building boom
happened and I was off and running..

There has been no comparable improvement in boys' verbal scores -
but neither has there been a campaign to help them in this area.

[The reason we wanted to "help" girls was because of the cultural
discrimination girls faced in classrooms where boys were expected to do
better in math and where teachers paid more attention TO boys. That
same situation does not exist for boys in the classroom. So what is to
be 'done' that would not foster SPECIAL RIGHTS for boys?]

Comprehensive. logic-based, hand-set skills that girls could do just. as.
well. at... if they were actually inclined to do more than look at fashion
magazines or worry about breaking a nail. Remember the old talking Barbie
doll that chirped out "Math is hard.."?

Tell that to the female archetects then so THEY can smile and look
upward as your *** walzes by.

You mean the junior partners that get stuck designing the decorative
elements? *LOL* Hello!

http://www.sniggle.net/barbie.php

Remember: http://www.sniggle.net/barbie.php

..."math is hard"


I do.

One> should be launched and it ought to be supported by anyone who has
the>> best interests of boys at heart.

[Denice, you would appear to support the idea of having SPECIAL RIGHTS
for boys in order to bring boys up to the standard girls exhibit. Why
is that?]

Because the current girl-friendly standards are inherently castrating to
boys and are turning out a generation of drones that are going into college
to find jobs that people in Bangalore can do cheaper, that's why.

Would you like fries with that?

So you want to exclude girls to give boys and edge so that we can keep
up? :-)

You do. It's how you can feel superior about yourself. And we're NOT keeping
up.. take a gander at the college quality assessments mentioned in the news
today. How delicious that as women gain ascendancy in higher education, it
is becoming more and more insufficient (dumbed down to make it
'girl-friendly') for meeting the global economic challenges.

It looks to me as if the girls are going to be in that position, just
by virtue of them caring more. So, it will be the boys serving the
fries, dear.

I rest my case.

Now, it will be argued that men and women are naturally different and
that, for genetic and hormonal reasons, females are by nature verbally
superior to males. Perhaps. However, even if there are biological
factors contributing to male weakness in this area, there is much that
can be done culturally to strengthen them.

[That's true, but without any discrimination being leveled against
boys, why should we invest more time and money in their education than
we do for girls? ]

Because girls aren't willfully entering into the hard work arena in numbers
great enough to keep the culture of comfort that most women demand, going.

Hahahahaha....one excuse for discrimination after another, eh BOY.
Women aren't buying your snake oil, hon. Girls get the same education
dollar spent on them, and if boys can't keep up, that's not the girl's
problem

It's not the dollar spent, it's the dollar spent on the touchy-feely crap
that's the problem. But that's okay. When these future women go looking for
Mr. right to get married to, they can have fun with the guy who dropped out
at 16. These oh so highly educated men are going to be *such* good husband
material, it's going to make these women-to-be SOOO happy! Oh no, not the
girl's problem at all. ;)

It's only a matter of time 'till your toilet clogs or your computer crashes
and what are you going to do? Call a MAN to fix it? Oh!! but that's right!
They've become 'sensitivity' trainers and don't DO 'hard' or technical
things like that anymore. Just think positive affirmation thoughts.. that
will fix it.. riiiight. Guess you'll have to wait while the lone guy who's
making 150 bucks a housecall decides if he even WANTS to deal with your
problem..

Why not call the ALL GIRL COMPANY of the future. It's right around the
corner. BTW, where I work now, most of the contractors are women.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if they last.

See what the girls are missing out on?

The girls are the future....apparently. After all they're the ones
getting the education.

And the boys aren't. Glad to see that makes you happy.

If anyone doubts that we can> lift male reading and writing abilities,
he or she need only look at the rise in female math scores to see the
positive results of concerted
education.

[Again, why are you demanding SPECIAL RIGHTS for boys. If boys are
falling behind based on some kind of discrimination against them, which
was the case for girls....I'd be happy to support such a program. But
I don't see any discrimination against boys.]

Of course you don't; you're still comfortable in your blind cocoon.


So prove it. Show me the money, 'Deb'. Where's the discrimination
against the lads?

I'm not going to even try to point it out to you. You will not allow
yourself to see it if it was tattooed inside your eyelids.

Blind cocoon indeed.

Deb.


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