Re: King's Kinsfolk: Richard II's kinsman, Edmund Stafford

Dear Newsgroup ~

An alternative theory to the identity of Hawise, wife of Ralph Basset,
1st Lord Basset, would be for her to be King Richard II's own
great-grandmother, Hawise de Quincy, who was widowed in 1282 and died
in 1285. Hawise was born about 1250 (being aged 14 in 1264). There is
barely enough time for her to have been the wife of Ralph Basset in the
period, 1282-1285, and given birth to his two children, Ralph and
Margaret, and then died in 1285.

This scenario seems doubtful, however, as I've found three references
to Hawise de Quincy as widow of Baldwin Wake: (1) in 1282 following her
husband's death; in 1283 when she was named heiress to her sister, Joan
de Quincy, wife of Humphrey de Bohun; and in 1285 at her death. These
records make it unlikely but not impossible for Hawise de Quincy to
have contracted a marriage to Ralph Basset in the period, 1282-1285.

All the same, I've found the following record in the helpful online A2A
Catalogue which shows that Ralph Basset of Drayton alienated rents out
of his manor of Drayton Basset, Staffordshire in August 1285 for a
chaplain at Farley. This may well have been done to celebrate the
anniversary of his wife's death. Since we know that Hawise de Quincy,
widow of Baldwin Wake, died early in 1285, the dating of this gift
would fit for Hawise de Quincy to have been Ralph Basset's lately
deceased wife.

Suffolk Record Office, Bury St Edmunds Branch: The Bunbury Family,
Reference: E 18/220/2: royal licence for the alienation in mortmain of
100s. rent from the manor of Drayton Basset from Ralph Basset of
Drayton to the chaplain at Farley. Date: 14 August 1285. END OF
QUOTE.

Regardless, if Hawise Basset was either Hawise de Quincy (widow of
Baldwin Wake) or Hawise de Vere (as suggested by John Ravilious), it
would make her descendant, Edmund Stafford, Bishop of Exeter, related
to King Richard II within the 5th degree on at least one side. Either
solution would give the Basset and Stafford families a descent from the
Quincy family.

Either solution would also work well with John Ravilious' own theory
that the Despenser family were descendants of the baronial Quincy
family. I find that Hugh le Despenser the younger referred to Hawise
Basset's son, Ralph Basset, 2nd Lord Basset of Drayton, as his "cousin"
[Reference: Chaplais, War of Saint-Sardos 1323-1325 (Camden Soc. 3rd
Ser. 87) (1954): vi, 75 & 80]. If Ralph Basset's mother was a Quincy
or a Vere (whose mother was a Quincy) and if the Despensers had a
Quincy connection, it would explain this otherwise unresolved kinship.
This matter deserves further study.

In further support of a Quincy connection, I find that the Quincy manor
of Long Buckby, Northamptonshire was afterwards in the hands of Ralph
Basset, 2nd Lord Basset. I'm uncertain how he obtained possession of
this manor. I suspect, however, that he was granted the manor by
Thomas, Earl of Lancaster, whose wife, Alice de Lacy, was heiress to
various Quincy family estates.

Comments are invited.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Website: www.royalancestry.net

Douglas Richardson royalancestry@xxxxxxx wrote:
> Dear Newsgroup ~
>
> As I've continued reading through book, The Diplomatic Correspondence
> of Richard II, it's quite interesting to see King Richard II's
> references to his various kinsfolk, both foreign and domestic.
>
> One surprising kinship which has turned up is Richard II's references
> to his kinsman, Edmund Stafford, then keeper of the privy seal,
> afterwards Bishop of Exeter. There are six such references to Edmund
> Stafford being the king's kinsman in the diplomatic correspondence:
>
> pp. 80-81 Letter of Richard II to Pope Boniface IX dated 1390: "...
> quod consanguineus noster carissimus Magister Edmundum de Stafford,
> legum doctor eximius ac licenciatus in decretis et custos nostri
> privati sigilli, ..."
>
> pg. 93. Petition from Richard II to Pope Boniface IX dated 1391.
> Petition asking for an episcopal promotion for "consanguineum nostrum
> Magistrum E. de Stafford, legum doctorem eximium et licenciatum in
> decretis, nostri privati sigilli custodem ..."
>
> pg. 113. Petition from Richard II to Pope Boniface IX dated 1392.
> Petition asking for promotion for "egregium virum magistrum Edmundum de
> S[tafford], consanguineum nostrum carissimum, qui profecto legum doctor
> eximius et licenciatus in decretis ac sigilli nostri privati custos
> existit."
>
> pp. 152-153. Letter from Richard II to Adam Easton, Cardinal of
> England dated 1391-1395: "... quod ipsa paternitas vestra carissimos
> clericos nostros magistrum Edmundum Stafford, nostrum consanguineum et
> custodem nostri privati sigilli super decanatu suo Ebor', et Johannem
> Boore, ...."
>
> pp. 153-154. Letter from Richard II to Adam Easton, Cardinal of
> England dated 1391-1395: "... carissimos clericos nostros magistrum E.
> de S[tafford], consanguineum nostrum et custodem nostri privati
> sigilli, super decanatu Ebor', et Johannem Boore, ..."
>
> pp. 157-158. Letter from Richard II to Pope Boniface IX dated 1395:
> "... carissimi consanguinei nostri magistri E[dmundi] de S[tafford],
> legum doctoris eximii et licenciati in decretis, nostri privati sigilli
> custodis ..."
>
> Edmund Stafford, Bishop of Exeter, was a younger son of Sir Richard de
> Stafford, Lord Stafford, by his 1st wife, Isabel, daughter of Richard
> de Vernon, Knt., of Haddon, Derbyshire. For particulars on the
> Stafford family, please see my book, Magna Carta Ancestry (2005), pp.
> 6-7. The most likely place for Edmund Stafford to be related to King
> Richard II would seemingly be through Edmund's great-grandmother,
> Hawise, wife of Ralph Basset (died 1300), 1st Lord Basset of Drayton.
> Hawise's identity is presently unknown. But, if she is the same person
> as Hawise, daughter of Robert de Vere, 5th Earl of Oxford, as recently
> theorized by the learned John Ravilious, then she would be near related
> to King Richard II. King Richard II's great-grandmother, Hawise de
> Quincy, was a first cousin to Hawise de Vere. If Hawise Basset was a
> Vere, it would also explain the subsequent rise to power of her
> descendants, the Bassets of Drayton and the Staffords.
>
> Due to the fact that the king's ancestry is largely Continental, Edmund
> Stafford's ancestry presumably connects to the king through only three
> English families found in the king's ancestry: Wake, Quincy, or
> Fiennes. So, the circle of possibilities of kinship is extremely
> narrow.
>
> Comments are invited.
>
> Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah
>
> Website: www.royalancestry.net

.

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