Re: Conservative Patrilineal Descent

In article <e00ce5$v2c$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, "Chano" <chano@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes:

<backon@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:e005uo$fqk$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

In article <h9EUf.6313$Mj.1026@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, "cindys"
<cstein1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes:

<karenelizabeth3@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1143146253.089001.238630@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

snipped for brevity

I live in a building with an electric eye in the door. If the doorman
sees religious Jews coming on Shabbos or a holiday, he opens it for
them. Otherwise, said Jews loiter around until the doorman notices
them and opens it. Sure, no words are said, but the message is pretty
darned clear. But that's apparently OK.

According to my understanding of the laws of shabbos, it's forbidden.


I agree. AMIRA L'AKUM has to be indirect and not new. Even gestures are
prohibited. What is permitted is the gentile (without being asked) to
put on an ADDITIONAL light in a room (already lit with one bulb).

The only reason why crossing an electric eye may be permitted is
PSIK REISHA D'LO NICHA LEI

In the original sha'alo the question of the electric sensor was to do with
opening the door. Perhaps we could say that the operating of the electric
eye to open the door is Psik reisha D'NICHA lei (we need the sensor to open
the door), and therefore assur.


But one doesn't really care HOW the door opens. Furthermore, since the
door could have been opened by OTHER means, there may not be a problem
with AMIRA L'AKUM.



and the fact that the light isn't incandescent .

Even if it was incandescent, in the case of a light being triggered by an
electric sensor, we could still apply PR D'Lo NL (permitted). A sha'alo
arose here in London where people walking home from shul on Shabbos night
had to pass houses where the sensors were triggered by people walking by and
lights were switched on. The people would then adopt the custom of walking
in the roadway past those houses in order to be out of range of the electric
sensors so that the lights woud not be switched on. Rav Elchonon Halpern
Sh'li'ta (the famous and respected "Reb Chuna") paskened that there was no
need to walk in the road way (a sakonoh -danger- in any case) even if people
knew that walking past those sensors would switch lights on (incandescent or
otherwise) because of PRD'LNL. The switching on of the light is eino
miskaven (not intentional) and such unintentended gerama actions are
permitted (Teshuvos Har Tzvi OC 133 & 188: Kovetz Ma'amarim B'inyaney
Chashmal B'shabbos p25)
--

Nice!!!

I actually have this sefer and will double check.

Josh


Chano


But one would need an expert in electronics [Where's
Micha, who has a degree in electrical engineering, when we need him ??]
to explain how the device works.
Josh



Best regards,
---Cindy S.



.

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