Re: ELIAHU ROOFF HAS LEFT THIS GROUP


"Adelle" <adNOstavis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote
>
> This is a terrible tragedy to this group.
Regulars leave newsgroups for all sorts of reasons; health, time pressures,
finding that content and arguments becoming repetitive, spousal pressure,
and, upsettingly, disagreements with moderators or other members.
We must accept that some people will go, new people will come, some people
will return after an absence. A newsgroup that fulfils a need will have
enough contributors to make it viable.
>
> In SJC, we had to deal with filth from people trying to attack Judaism
> through porn, neo-nazi stuff, and such. And now, within this forum we have
> to deal with filthy attacks from someone who (hardly) hides his contempt
> within religious discourse.
>
You can moderate out Nazis and other anti-Semites, spam, and missionaries.
On balance this is a good thing, though it does lead to problems. For
instance Palestinian Arabs have got legitimate issues that must be
discussed, but it is not easy to draft a definition of acceptable posts that
includes them but excludes the fringe agitators. So the result is that we
don't have any regular Palestinian posters, which maybe leads to a distorted
perspective.
What you cannot do is moderate out contempt, and impose an ideal community.
You can ban words like "anti-Semite" (completely fatuous when applied to
another Jew) but it is harder to ban "bigot". If you try you actually make
the post more offensive, as the accuser abandons shorthand and explains
exactly why the person is a "self-hating Jew".
>
> A terrible way to go into Shabbat! Shame on all of us.
>
> I already self edit because even people I otherwise admire enjoy putting
> down any practice that doesn't meet their strictest interpretation of
> halacha. This is no longer a forum for all Jews. Just ones who are in lock
> step.
>
The specific problem was that most organisations need to deny benefits of
membership to people who do not accept the obligations. Someone who sends
his children to a secular university, but remains a member in good standing
of an community where this is seen as incompatible with their way of life,
is a huge threat. The sacrifice in not having a university degree is very
large, and pretty soon either everyone will send their children to college,
or there will be a reaction and the community will split.
However a lot of organisations do also accept marginal members, people who
maybe show up for some meetings and push pamphlets through doors at election
times, but don't spend days on committees preparing the report on local
government debt servicing charges. This works when the benefits are also
marginal - such people get cheap drinks at the bar, but aren't considered as
candidates for winnable seats.

A Jewish community technically gathers for the purpose of serving God, and
so it is not generally possible to formally give different levels of benefit
to different categories of members. That doesn't mean that the rules don't
exist.
>
> P.S. What happened to moderators revoke approval for posts which contain
> ad homonim attacks? Has auto-approval been revoked, at least?
The auto-approval needs looking at. The basic idea is sound - someone who
has been posting for a few weeks is quite clearly not a spammer, missionary,
or neo-Nazi, so there isn't any real point in moderating his posts.
Unfortunately it becomes seen as a badge of full group membership, so
withdrawal is perceived as an insult. It may also be perceived as a licence
to post, so that rejection of marginal posts, such as ones calling Eliyahu a
"bigot", is seen as an attack on the poster's status within the group.


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Proposed Process for Charter Amendment
    ... > of serving the community doesn't match yours, ... That's why they're the moderators. ... I don't see that assumtion in your posts. ... > I hope by now all the mods are following this thread. ...
    (soc.culture.jewish.moderated)
  • Re: Totally Off Topic re Freecycle
    ... "community" side of Freecycle. ... the "I want it" posts. ... While it's true that Freecycle is supposed to exist to ... Sounds as if your moderators might be killing the ...
    (rec.pets.cats.anecdotes)
  • Re: Moderated sci.astro.amateur
    ... community. ... 151 posts in 59 topics by 52 members. ... yourself and/or a short audio greeting to the forum members, ...
    (sci.astro)
  • Moderated sci.astro.amateur
    ... This is to announce a relatively new astro forum to the sci.astro ... community. ... 151 posts in 59 topics by 52 members. ...
    (sci.astro)
  • Re: Ping Gigglz: My "10 Universal Rules of Newsgroup Participation"
    ... of the moderators have nothing but a control problem. ... if you don't hate the same people they hate, ... behaviors from other group members and ex group members! ...
    (alt.support.chronic-pain)