Re: Leftists, Networks, News Media SILENT about Al-Qaeda Torture Chambers

"Mavisbeacon" <beacon@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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"Shogun" <shogunattantonet> wrote in message
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"Mavisbeacon" <beacon@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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"Shogun" <shogunattantonet> wrote in message
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"Mavisbeacon" <beacon@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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[snip]





Before I can focus on the ignorance that abounds in Mavisbeacon's
ballyhoos, I must qualify Mavisbeacon's character, his sources,
and even his personal frame of mind towards me. To begin at the
beginning, I could go on for pages listing innumerable examples
of Mavisbeacon's foul criticisms and myopic apologues.

In other words rather than deal with the issues you raised you
would rather indulge yourself in the charachter assassination of
the person who raised them!
A palpaple case of "I don't like the message so I will try to
shoot the messeenger"

You do more of the same in your last post. verbosity does not
detract form this point.



I have already written enough, surely,
to convince you that contrary to my personal preferences, I'm
thinking about what's best for all of us.

But your "surely" is again backed up by no evidence! You produce
NO EVIDENCE from what you have already written. You argue from
opinion, uninformed and unsupported by any references!

Still no evidence just verbose opinion.


My conclusion is that what's best for
all of us is for me to put an end to Mavisbeacon's evildoing.

But you dont define "evildoing" nor do you pruduce any evidence as
to your authority to make such an argument!

We are still waiting! Where is it?




I do not
wish to evaluate feudalism here, though I think that it's really
not bloody-mindedness that compels me to argue about
Mavisbeacon's outbursts.

Again, no reference to anything that may be classified as
"outbursts".

Where is it?



It's my sense of responsibility to you, the reader. So maybe
all people, including hidebound shysters, ought to be kind and
sensitive to one another. Big deal. What's more important is that
I have a New Year's resolution for Mavisbeacon: He should pick up
a book before he jumps to the salacious conclusion that he is a
perpetual victim of injustice.

I NEVER made such a claim nor can you show where I did! I pointed
to clear cases of ad hominem and trying to attack me rather than
deal with the issues you raised about the left not critisising al
Queda only proves my point!

You cant show wher I did! where is hte evidence? Nor have you shown
anythiong to support your claims about the left have you?
[snip]

In spite your verbose sidestep into oratory you cant fast talk you
way out of supporting your own claims about the left never
criticising muslim fundamentalists!

Still no evidence have you?


He hates
it when you say that I challenge him to crawl out of his
sheltered existence and shatter the adage that children don't
need as much psychological attentiveness, protection, and
obedience training as the treasured household pet.

It isn't a question of ME being challenged. YOU are the one who
made claims about the left not criticising fundamentalists!

I showed you wheere they did. You are clearly WRONG! But you wont't
admit that will you?


He really hates it when you say that. Try
saying it to him sometime, if you have a thick skin and don't
mind having him shriek insults at you. The word
"hematospectrophotometer" is so compromised that I retain it only
as a pejorative. Now take that to the next level: Mavisbeacon has
never satisfactorily proved his assertion that the average
working-class person can't see through his chicanery.

I never made such an assertion! Unlike YOU who made the assertion
that the left were silent about torture!

AND WHICH YOU DIDNT SUPPORT EH?




He has merely justified that assertion with the phrase,
"Because I said so."

I never claimed anything based on "because I said so" unlike you
who above stated " I have already written enough, surely,"


What do we owe Mavisbeacon? Nothing, absolutely nothing. If he
claims otherwise, we have to stand firm and point out that
Mavisbeacon has no discernible talents.

I don't claim to be owed anything. I ask in this case that YOU
support your own claims! Please don't try to shift the burden onto
me.

[snip more ad hominem]


Now stay with me a moment here; I am making a point.
Specifically, not only does Mavisbeacon attack everyone else's
beliefs, but he then commands his backers, "Go, and do thou
likewise."

I never claimed that!
Cant support that either can you?



His "I'm right and
you're wrong" attitude is polyloquent, because it leaves no room
for compromise. Mavisbeacon has a vested interest in making me
turn to a life of crime, but that's really beside the point.

Then why make the point? Perhaps because you also want to brand me
as a criminal? In fact I never stated "im right and you are wrong"
I just asked YOU when YOU make YOUR claim to "prove it"!


I apologize if the following points are hard to follow but
they're quite relevant to the gist of my argument. First, the
idea of letting Mavisbeacon throw away our freedom, our honor,
and our future is, in itself, inerudite.

It is also unfounded and illogical.

And irrelevant!




And second, belligerent talebearers often prove their
point by relying on untenable conjecture and unverifiable
hearsay.

I provide counter evidence, and dont tell tall tales. I have
provided NO hearsay, all my sources are verifable. And I am not
making the point. YOU are! I challenge YOUR point and whn
challenged you run away from it and resort to personal attack!

All
of this means, of course, that if he had done his homework, he'd
know that he recently claimed that mediocrity is a worthwhile
goal.

Where and when did I calim that? any evidence?

Nope thought not!




I would
have found this comment shocking had I not heard similar garbage
from him a hundred times before.

Pity you cant provede ONE example then isnt it? Who do you expect
the readers to believe?

Still no examples eh?


[snip]
At least putting up with
another Mavisbeacon hissy fit is easier than convincing
Mavisbeacon's habitués that this makes me fearful that I might
someday find myself in the crosshairs of Mavisbeacon's
capricious, censorious anecdotes. (To be honest, though, it
wouldn't be the first time.)

Really?
What would be the first time then?
In spite of getting someone else to write this screed for you it
seems you/they are stil lunable to support their claims.

Yeah. No support here either is there?


[snip]


Mavisbeacon teaches workshops on commercialism.

You have no evidence for this either have you?

Thought not!
[snip]

SO? Why cant ou support you r claims? like the one about the left
never criticising AL Queda?

You cant can you?

[snip]
If this is your own work Shogun congradulations your prose is
improving even if you logic isnt. If not credit the author.

You didn't write it did you?







The furor over defeatism has been an acutely frustrating cultural
phenomenon: pregnant with great possibility, touching on vital and
fascinating issues, yet initially formulated in a one-sided and
demented manner that will promote a herd mentality over principled,
individual thought any day now.
Where is there evidence for this furore?

What's important to note, however, is that
Mavisbeacon's vaporings share many of the same characteristics.

In what way? You have neither supported your thesis nor provided and
evidence to like me to it!

Before I
say anything else, let me remind Mavisbeacon that his ethics are
precisely the kind of thing that will commit acts of immorality,
dishonesty, and treason some day -- and Mavisbeacon knows it.

Agaion you have no reference to support this bald assertion have
you?

There is
still hope for our society, real hope -- not the false sense of
hope that comes from the mouths of the most primitive upstarts I've
ever seen, but the hope that makes you eager to advocate concrete
action and specific quantifiable goals. Although there's no denying
that you should never be impressed by positions or titles but only
by honorable deeds,

I never argued form authority. YOU did! You only contradict yourself
here!

it may be somewhat more controversial to allege that when he hears
anyone say that he never seems to listen to anyone else's positions
and reasoning, his answer is to stifle dissent.

I am quite capable of discerning a reasonable argument. You have
adopted ad hominem (as you are now doing attacking the person rather
than the issue), shifting the burden and a number of other
fallacious modes which I have indicated to you and you have ignored.

[snip -irrelevant methphor ]


Honest people will admit that there is no justification on any
level whatsoever for Mavisbeacon's intolerant, balmy catch-phrases.

Sadly you cant list ANY or show why anything I say isnt supported
and sadly you miss the point AGAIN! It isn't for me to porove the
issues. YOU raised them it is for YOU to support them. Don't try to
shift the burden of proof onto me!

Concerned
people are not afraid to criticize the obvious incongruities
presented by Mavisbeacon and his stooges.

Again shifting the burden. I didn't present a case, I countered YOUR
CASE.

[snip more irrelevant unsupported prose]
I feel that anyone with eyes
and a brain can tell that I am intellectually honest enough to
admit my own previous ignorance in that matter.

If you are intellectually hoinest then support your original
claiums! And suport you claims about me!

I only wish that he had the same
intellectual honesty.

I don't have to prove a negative! appeals that I should are
fallacious.


In contrast, I claim that the best way to overcome
misunderstanding, prejudice, and hate is by means of reason, common
sense, clear thinking, and goodwill.

You have hurled terms of abuse at me. That is not goodwill is it?
You have failed to tackl;e the logical inconsistencies and
contradictions in your arguments. Is that common sense clear
thinking or reason? As for prejudice, you have constantly harped on
the neo-cons agenda even when the bigoted way you avoid reasoned
debate is indicated to you. Don't look for the splinter in other
people's eyes when you fail to recognise the plank in your own.


Mavisbeacon, in contrast, believes that skin color means
more than skill and gender is more impressive than genius.

Snip the rest of your cut and paste. come on! You did a "find and
replace " excercise didnt you? Since you only added in the word
"Mavisbeacon" it is a waste of time rebutting something which is
simple to do. You are too lazy and too dishonest and inept to
support your own position.

Troll someone else!





[snip florid introduction full os assertiona nd personal attack NONE
of which was supported by evidence

... everything I've said so far is
by way of introduction to the key point I want to make in this
letter. My key point is that he plans to dupe his assistants into
believing that truth is whatever your grievance group says it is.

I have stated again and again, YOU are the one making claims about al
Queda, WMD, the left not criticising. I only aks you to support your
claims with evidence (which you have NOT done) and (though not
necessary for me to do so since it is for you to prove YOUR
assertions) I post counter evidence!

[snip]
Does Mavisbeacon have a point? I unquestionably doubt it.

Dont try to shift the burden onto me. It isnt for me to support points
which YOU claimed such as the left never criticising muslim
fundamentalists.



[snip]
insults. From what I know of his offhand remarks, he is saying
essentially three things:

1. War is peace, freedom is slavery, and ignorance is strength.

You robbed that one fromn George Orwell's 1984 (again without
attribution) ! And again you provide no ciotation to support your
claims about the earlier work.

[snip]

Be honest; can you in any way believe Mavisbeacon's claim that all
any child needs is a big dose of television every day?

I never made such a claim and you cant support that with citation can
you?

[snip more empty rhetoric which offers NO EVIDENCE]



Please pardon the dastardly overtones that will be found throughout this
letter, but Mavis Beacon's votaries constitute the only species of
animal life that is both mammalian and invertebrate. For practical
reasons, I have to confine my discussion to areas that have received
insufficient public attention or in which I have something new to say.
Beacon says that the laws of nature don't apply to him. The inference is
that character development is not a matter of "strength through
adversity" but rather, "entitlement through victimization". I'm happy to
report that I can't follow that logic.

When asked to mend his ways, Beacon will give people a wink and a smile,
but when the wheels begin to turn, it's business as usual. I have two
words for him: Grow up! If he wants to cripple his enemies politically,
economically, socially, morally, and psychologically, let him wear the
opprobrium of that decision. As for the lies and exaggerations, we
should agree on definitions before saying anything further about
Beacon's crazy crotchets. For starters, let's say that "frotteurism" is
"that which makes Beacon yearn to perpetuate inaccurate and dangerous
beliefs about male-female relationships." Allow me to explain. His
comrades often reverse the normal process of interpretation. That is,
they value the unsaid over the said, the obscure over the clear.

Yes, Beacon may be nothing more than a disposable tool of power-
wielding, cheeky carpers, but philistinism is the last refuge of the
loathsome. Sadly, lack of space prevents me from elaborating further. As
that last sentence suggests, he claims that we can all live together
happily without laws, like the members of some 1960s-style dope-smoking
commune. That claim is preposterous and, to use Beacon's own language,
overtly catty. No history can justify it. I receive a great deal of
correspondence from people all over the world. And one of the things
that impresses me about it is the massive number of people who realize
that "Beacon" has now become part of my vocabulary. Whenever I see
someone provoke terrible, total, universal, and merciless destruction, I
tell him or her to stop "Beacon-ing". I attribute the social and
psychological problems of modern society to the fact that if I didn't
think he would turn back the clock and repeal all the civil rights and
anti-discrimination legislation now on the books, I wouldn't say that
documents written by his habitués typically include the line, "All
minorities are poor, stupid ghetto trash", in large, 30-point type, as
if the size of the font gives weight to the words. In reality, all that
that fancy formatting really does is underscore the fact that Beacon
can't attack my ideas, so he attacks me. It could be worse, I suppose.
He could hurt others physically or emotionally. Stand with me, be honest
with me, and help me improve the physical and spiritual quality of life
for the population at present and for those yet to come, and together
we'll investigate Mavis Beacon's brain-damaged principles, ideals, and
objectives. We'll prescribe a course of action. I'm counting on you.
Thanks for reading this.
.

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