Re: Apakah Ada Orang Yg Begini Kejam?

On Aug 21, 4:36 pm, sam1...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
On Aug 20, 1:45 pm, donie <donien...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Aug 20, 12:37 pm, donie <donien...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

On Aug 18, 10:47 am, "Raja Singa" <peliwoelo...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Apakah ada nabie Allah yang begini kejam didalam Alkitab orang Kristen?

Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 52, Number 261:

Eight men of the tribe of 'Ukil came to the Prophet and then they found the
climate of Medina unsuitable for them. So, they said, "O Allah's Apostle!
Provide us with some milk." Allah's Apostle said, "I recommend that you
should join the herd of camels." So they went and drank the urine and the
milk of the camels (as a medicine) till they became healthy and fat.. Then
they killed the shepherd and drove away the camels, and they became
unbelievers after they were Muslims. When the Prophet was informed by a
shouter for help, he sent some men in their pursuit, and before the sun rose
high, they were brought, and he had their hands and feet cut off. Then he
ordered for nails, which were heated and passed over their eyes, and they
were left in the Harra (i.e. rocky land in Medina). They asked for water,
and nobody provided them with water till they died.

BEGINNING OF MUHAMMAD'S VIOLENCE

Just prior to Muhammad's leaving for Medina, he received  a
"revelation" allowing him to fight the Meccans.  He knew that in
Medina, he had a group of armed men who would support him.
Furthermore, in Medina, would be more distant from the Meccans and
their attempts to oppress or kill him.  The following is from "The
Life of Muhammad", page 212, by A. Guillaume, which is a rendering of
Ibn Ishaq's "Sirat Rasulallah", a biography of Muhammad written by an
early Muslim scholar  [1].

            "THE APOSTLE RECEIVES THE ORDER TO FIGHT

 The apostle had not been given permission to fight or allowed to shed
blood before the second Aqaba [a place where a pledge was made between
Muhammad and his followers from Medina]. He had simply been ordered to
call men to God and to endure insult and forgive the ignorant. The
Quraysh [a leading group of Meccans] had persecuted his followers,
seducing some from their religion and exiling others from their
country. They had to choose whether to give up their religion, be
maltreated at home, or to flee the country, some to Abyssinia, others
to Medina.

 --snip--

The article you quoted was from a book titled :
- Life of Muhammad : A Translation of Ibn Ishaq's Sirat
                                       Rasul Allah

written by A Guillaume in 1955 or thereabouts.
He was an orientalist. He was not an islamic scholar.

Appended is the review of the book. As usual , non
muslims laud the book and muslims claimed that
guillaume lied and equivocated. Interestingly there
are a couple of non muslims who are quite familiar
with hadiths and ibn ishaq's works stated that
guillaume lied and equivocated. Even an ex denier
of the existence of orientalist admitted that guillaume
lied and equivocated. I am pasting his comments.

Need I say more , the facts speaks for itself. Looks
like you christians prefer to believe in the rantings
and rhetorics of spin doctors rather than the truth.
Are you capable to handle the truth should be the
pertinent question.

            ********************************

ref :http://www.amazon.com/review/product/019636034X/ref=cm_cr_pr_link_2?%...

By A Customer
One of the dangers of studying Islam "in-depth" in
the English language lies in the fact that most major
classical works are not translated by Muslims. The
danger is not that a Non-Muslim translated a classical
Arabic scripture, for a brilliant impartial non-Muslim
scholar of Arabic is as good as a more mediocre
Muslim counterpart. The danger arises when the
translation is undertaken by an Orientalist. Orientalists,
for those who do not know them, or naively deny their
existence (as I myself used to at one time) are
Western scholars who "privately" view the Prophet
Muhammad as a total sham who made up the whole
Quran and religion of Islam as being something from
God. When they translate classical works of Islam
with this personal viewpoint, the language they use
invariably starts to reflect this view. For example, they
have a choice of saying the "the Prophet believed he
saw the Angel" or they can also say "The Prophet
claimed he saw the Angel", the hidden nuances
are pretty apparent here.

This translation of ibn ishaq is by reknown orientalist
Alfred Guillaume. One would be well-advised to secure
a copy of his well-known introduction to Islam titled
"ISLAM" to get a better idea of his attitude towards Islam.
It becomes clear, reading between the lines, that he
does not believe whatsoever that the Prophet Muhammad
could have been a geniuine article. One can only imagine
what treatment he gives to the ibn ishaq manuscript.

Infact, there is no need to imagine!! it is there in black
and white for all to see. And how is that you may ask?
At one point in the text of this translation you find the
following:

"the Prophet quoted some newly revealed verses and
the next day, Jibril, the Angel, came to the Prophet and
asked him [where did you get that? I did not bring down
these verses!!!]" This incident basically suggests that
the Prophet "made-up" some Quranic verses.

When I first read this in Guillaume's translation, my eyes
almost popped out of their sockets. I could not believe it!
So I went to a learned friend of mine who had the original
Sirat ibn ishaq in Arabic, and we corroborated this
English edition and the Arabic original, and guess what!
It is not there in the Arabic! At first I was quite perplexed,
then I looked more closely, and Lo! It turns out, that this
incident was a note added by Guillaume!!!!

The equally suspect Oxford University Press has typeset
this work with Guillaume's notes not at the bottom with
footnote numbering, but within the main body of the text
itself. They have reduced the font-size of Guillaume's
notes by one point, and it is often hard to distinguish
where the notes begin and where the actual ibn ishaq's
text ends.

It was not until later that I realized the implications of
this occurrence, when I first came across Guillaume's
ISLAM and realized he was an orientlaist, and more
recently when I came across Bashir Zakariyya's book
THE MAKKAN CRUCIBLE where he dedicates a
whole APPENDIX to this particular fabrication created
by a host of Orientalists to undermine the Prophet's
credibility.

In conclusion, I advise most readers to read this
translation with a grain of salt. And I pray, that in a
strange twist of irony, the Western-financed Saudi
petro dollar will commission a more accurate
rendering of this most classical of Islamic works.

       *********************************

sam1528

If I were you Sam, I would challenge the substance rather than
labeling the translators. I would correct their translation. Or, why
wouldn't you muslims translate them yourself? Your arabic islamic
history is translatable after all, isn't it?
.

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