Re: Any Germans In Here?

Michael Muetterlein wrote:
Hi,
"T Jr Hardman" <blockspam_thardman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I think you politely didn't mention that it's not sensible to think of "the
Germans" as a monolithic bloc.

My answer was just meant very direct and did not contain anything between the lines, at least not by intention. You just point out the obvious: Humans are individuals, even if they have the same nationality.

Oh certainly this is true. One can't speak of "the Americans" or "the Canadians" or "the Iraqi", outside of a certain level of abstraction. One could say "the Americans are overweight" and that would be true on average. But I have certainly seen many who are very skinny.

Really, over here in the States, we don't hear a lot about Germany.
Where I am, we get maybe a half-hour of television from Deutsche Welle, and
that's on the community-college educational channel, and furthermore it's
in English.
Would you like to watch german TV news and political talk, or what is it?
Possibly that would be interesting. Probably I wouldn't follow the issues or
understand the concerns, where those concerns were about local issues or
even generic European issues. But it would also be interesting to try to
learn a little German language from watching news or drama in that language.

then I recommend a visit on www.dw-world.de or www.tagesschau.de. And for TV shows, give www.onlinetvrecorder.com a try.

Excellent! Danke! I have also been to youtube.com and searched out "german" this-and-that, but mostly it's some short clips, or performance video. The one about "germans really do dig holes everywhere they go" was pretty amusing. But youtube.com isn't any proper way to think you're getting the depth of the culture. ;)

I would certainly be getting the wrong picture from watching this video?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_acAje6RHU
Deichkind - "Ich betäube mich". This is hilarious, to me.

We have out little imitation Oktoberfest here in the States, it varies from
region to region. In the same way that everyone pretends to be Irish when
it's Saint Patrick's Day, for Oktoberfest everyone pretends to be German. It
might be useful to have some idea if we're doing it right. ;)

For me, there seem to be not too many things that can be done wrong here. Well, yodeling and coo-coo-clocks would not belong there, and keep out of the area with white bread in your hands. :-)

Actually, for some years there were singers who were famous for their yodeling, but that was maybe 40-50 years ago. Roy Rogers, "the singing cowboy", I think. Of course, where I live, I am not too far from Pennsylvania and the "pennsylvania dutch", so at least I can get food that is close to being authentic.


Getting a driver's permit or vehicle registration is generally
fast and simple

For the driver's license, how simple? In Germany, 14 hours of lessons and 12 hours practise in traffic (under surveillance of a teacher) are mandatory before one is even admitted to a practical examination.

I had heard that it was much more demanding. Our requirements vary from one State to another, but in Maryland the requirements are quite similar. Our might even be more strict, especially for persons under the age of 18.


Generally the public schools have real problems providing an education
suitable for continuation in college. But if you will compare the
world rankings for math and science skills, Germany consistently scores
much better than do the States.
We used to be able to put a lot of lower-achievement students into
vocational/technical schools and these people were the backbone of the
industrial economy. But we no longer do as much manufacturing, and as more
people go to university, the quality of the graduates is thought to be
suffering.

A German student can only do the step forward to college or university if his grades after 10 school years are good enough, otherwise his time at school ends here.

Our school system covers 12 grades, each grade being one year, from ages 6 to 18 years. There will probably be some kindergarten and probably before that some "pre-school".

Education is compulsory for most people until they are 16, which normally would be completing 10th grade. Most do go on to graduate, though some 25-percent or more drop out of school. For some, "advanced placement" ("AP") is available, and some schools are "magnet schools" which concentrate deserving or talented students into groups with a focus on their special area. There is a new phenomenon of allowing the best students to go from 10th grade into colleges, under the so-called "international baccalaureate" program. This is said to resemble the German system, and possibly the system of other countries.

Ordinarily, admission into university is very competitive, and of course applicants must show their diligence and achievement, primarily from standardized tests such as PSAT and SAT "scholastic aptitude tests". However, "community colleges" are widespread, and often are the stepping-stones from a weak public school education towards admission to university. They also offer 2-year degrees, for such things as electronic technician or dental hygeinist, veterinary assistant, that sort of thing. Or people can take courses just to learn something new.


I'm rather curious about differing approaches to public education, as I see
a real need for educational reform here in the States.

In Germany we have a division in talented and not-so-talented children after the elementary school. The talented are permitted for the high school (where high standards are set to them) any may spend their 5th to 13th school year at the same facility, preparing for university or college. The not-so-talented have to visit the secondary school where standards are not so high and the students are heading for a vocational training or the public sector. Changing between these schools is possible if the performance of the student makes this appear appropriate.

If you look at our school system, you may find, in fact, a division in three school branches with different standards (Gymnasium > Realschule > Hauptschule). Students visiting the one with the lowest standards are more likely to end up jobless, because students from other schools are preferred. If you need a stereotype of a "Hauptschule" in these days (as it may exist in the heads of too many people since some incidents on a Berlin school made headlines), watch "The Principal" (with J. Belushi) and you will know what I mean.

(please tell me if you do not understand something I wrote- I have to use a dictionary here and I have got my doubts about some of the translations)

So far it's very good, I assure it is better than my command of German.

I think that our equivalent of "Hauptschule" would be "college preparatory academy". Very stringent admissions standards, probably expensive, possibly owned by a church organization, etc. My father (born in 1917 into a German-speaking farm community in Kansas) has referred to "parochial schools", which educated in both German and English and had very high academic standards and produced excellent graduates who almost certainly went on to university. Comparable schools still exist here, which aren't either public (tax funded) nor religious. Generally we just call them "private schools".

I think your "Gymnasium" is probably like our standard public highschool (grades 10, 11, 12), and perhaps the Realschule would be more like our "magnet schools".

Seriously, though, increasing numbers of Americans don't have time to cook
at home, so they eat out.

It's not so bad yet in Germany, but the number of people that know how to prepare a meal from raw food is decreasing. I am living on canned and frozen food myself. :-)

Yes, I have the opinion that McD's is for people who don't have the time to put the "TV dinner" in the microwave oven. I can cook simple meals for myself, I was once a short-order cook at a variety of restaurants. But I am no gourmet chef. Increasingly there is demand for a higher quality of TV-dinner and various companies are responding to that demand, and for $3.00 you can get pretty good frozen meals, about the same cost as a burger, fries, and a soda (or juice) at McD's. So the TV-dinners are more healthy, taste better, cost the same, and you use less gasoline than if you were to drive to a fast-food place.


"Joe Citizen" or "Average Joe" is a sort of hazy statistical concept.
[...]
"Joe Sixpack" is pretty much "Average Joe" but [...]

Very enlightening. I find it very interesting that the differences made it so far that these guys even have different names!

Oh, we have names for all sorts of "cliche" groups. Some of those are so stereotypical that they are known targets for advertising agencies and political campaigns. There is the well-known "red state/blue state" political division, one one side there are the stereotypical "gun loving redneck beer drinking fundamentalist republicans" and on the other side the stereotypical "hippie era love child liberal-arts college bleeding hearts democrats". The bothersome thing is that such people actually exist, and actually respond to advertisements, and do so in large enough numbers to make the advertising profitable. It becomes worse in election years.

We have quite a lot of "demographics" (subsets, subcultures) with rather silly names and descriptions. Sadly, some of that is on-target[1]. Don't get me started on these, I will embarass the nation and frighten prospective tourists. ;)

Probably you have comparable "demographics" like banking-sector workers, public servants, fashion-victims, art-lovers, etc.


Ref:
1. I fall into the category "basement-dwelling technophile". 8-D


--
To study and not think is a waste.
To think and not study is dangerous.
-- Confucius, _Analects_, 2:15
.

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