Re: Kial Esperanto ne sukcesis en la mondo ? Sur neuxtrala lingva fundamento

dmitri mosier:

Lee (Alex) Miller wrote:
Aux ecx "bonvole pardonu min" aux "pardonu al mi" aux "pardonon" . . . It's
not really an issue of the Akademio, but an issue of usage. In its 100+
year history, Esperanto has developed customary ways of saying things, and
deviations from those customary expressions, while they may make perfect
sense, will have a ring of "not quite right."

And thereby the one advantage of Esperanto over the natlangs has been
lost. I get so frustrated in my language studies when I'm told "i know
what you mean but we just don't say it like that"...........I turned to
Esperanto precicely because that was (supposed to be) one of the major
advantages over natlangs. If it makes sense, it's right.

"Pardonu min ege" means "forgive me a lot" -- as if you wouldn't care
to ask for an apology if your fault wasn't big enough. I think that's
what sounded a bit awkward; "mi ege pardonpetas" means "I beg pardon",
and that would not sound awkward (though maybe a little exaggerated),
because "ege" is about the intensity of one's feelings of guilt, rather
than the size of the apology asked for.

BTW, don't begin to use "bonvole pardonu" in stead of "bonvolu pardoni"
as Lee does; a lot of people do so, but it sounds just never awkward
enough to be worth reacting to. Same itching as with "pardonu ege",
though.


Are we going to tell all the people out there who calque phrases from
their own languages, which phrases make perfect sense and express the
meaning intended, they're wrong just because the European contingent
thinks it sounds "not quite right"? If that's the case, Esperanto is
no better than a natlang and I'll quit and work towards Spanish.

Logic isn't easier than just doing as everybody else does. Esperanto
may be easier to get at than other languages, but the widely driven
logic is not so much used to make the language easy, as to make it so
stable that it doesn't fall apart when it develops.

Seems Lee Sau Dan has had a point (or maybe a few) all these years,
afterall.

Have you changed, Dmitri? I have. I've become better at erasing
LSD-points than I was back then.

....

How long before the neologists oust the schematists and "malsanulejo"
just "doesn't sound quite right" when compared to "hospitalo"?

Privataj kuracistoj ofte devas enhospitaligi pacienton. Aux, se vi
preferas, almalsanulejigi kuracaton. Krom, kompreneble, tiujn
kuracatojn kiuj estas nekuraceblaj, kaj sekve ne kuracotaj, kvankam ili
estas kuracataj. Tiujn oni sendas hejmen aux al... hospico?
Mortantejo? Forpasontejo? La libera kunmetado de elementoj estas
utilega, sed gxi havas siajn limojn.

Amike,
Jens S. Larsen

.

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