Re: German parliament leader chides Cuba elections as 'farce'

On 23 jan, 05:45, Dan Christensen <dch...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Jan 22, 2:46 am, PL <P...@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

[snipping portions of PL's posting already debunked here, or too lame
to bother with]

To guard against any abuse of power, the Cuban people themselves have
the ultimate veto.

(snip)

What Mr. Lobbyist snipped for obvious reasons:

To guard against any abuse of power, the Cuban people themselves have
the ultimate veto.

(snip)

You can snip, but you cannot hide, Mr. Lobbyist!

What he snipped for obvious reasons:

To guard against any abuse of power, the Cuban people themselves have
the ultimate veto.

Nope.
The system has the ultimate veto as it has full control over any
"candidate" that can stand - over and over again.

Unlike Americans, Cubans have the right to reject
ALL candidates
(snip)

actually so can US voters by not voting.


Nope they haven't as in any case the "candidates" will be always
selected by the regime.

This was already debunked here.

Never debunked.
At national level the regime via the mass organizations its controls
has 100% control over who can stand.

The Cuban people are quite capable of
selecting their OWN candidates.
(snip)

Yep.
And they are very well able to choose between them in a free and fair
secret ballot.
that is the only democratic way to go: choice between different
opinions instead of having one imposed

As long as there is no system that guarantees that even those that
oppose the regime can stand there will be no free and fair elections.

This is already the case.

Nope it isn't.
At the local level the CDR can block anyone.
At the national level they people has no say whatsover.
The government controlled mass oragnizations have a veto againts any
candidate.
the communist trade union will automatically reject anyone from the
free trade unions for example.
The CDR will reject anyone with dissident "tendencies".
That is reality: total control by the rgeime.

You are just pissed off that the Cuban
people won't support this "opposition" of yours,
(snip)

actually not.
I am just pissed of they can't live their own opposition and have
their human righst respected.


false.
the system controls the nomination of candidates and controls who gets
on the ballot.

You are just pissed off that your di$$ident pals can't even get the
necessary support of their own neighbours.

(snip)
Nope.
Pissed of that people that peacefully express their opinions are
jailed.

They were jailed for the aiding the enemy,

Nope.
For speaking out.
They were recognized by Amnesty International as prisoners of
conscience.

Nothing can change that.
that makes it a farce.http://www.cubaverdad.net/elections_in_cuba.htm

Your lying website again???

You are the only one with a lying website (that had part of it removed
by your IP just for that).

The only "lies" at my website were quotes from you, Mr. Lobbyist,
(snip)

Nope.
The lies were contained in the concocted falsification you put on
their in violation of the rights of others.
But thanks for admitting that what you put up and desperately tried to
keep up was removed.

Get real! BTW, when are you going to
remove that lie about your supposed "UN assessment?"

No lie.
Direct and refernced quote from the UN report on Cuba by the UN
rapporteur Dan

[snip]

I see you no longer include the link.

here it is:
http://www.cubaverdad.net/elections_in_cuba.htm
there people can find the correct quote and the link to the UN
website:
http://www.hri.ca/fortherecord1998/vol4/cubachr.htm

Is that because it shows that
the UN Human Rights Commission actually rejected this report

Nope. they didn't.
The political body decided in a narrow vote decided by the abstainers
that they would not impose sanctions.
In no way they criticized or rejected any part of the report.
the report is still there as part of the UN body of information

, and
terminated the mandate of this "rapporteur,"
(snip)

and later on nominating another as the ebb and tide of politics flow.
That doesn't change anything as far as the reported facts go.

Again the standard reply to your "lobbyist" lie Mr. Cyber-liar:

Quote me comrade Dan. You claimed you can and you never did.
We both know you can't.

Try something like this:

Quote:
"In my opinion the advances made by the Revolution are morally well
worth fighting for and justify the use of these extraordinary
measures.
In this case, the ends do indeed justify the means.
=3D3D3D2E......
These measures, however, would NOT be morally justified in propping
less
worthy regimes in the region -- the USA and its vassal states in the
Caribbean and Latin America come immediately to mind."

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=3D3D3D3Den&lr=3D3D3D3D&ie=3D3D3D3DUTF-8&s=
elm=3D3D=3D
3D3DtirG=3D3D
3.176162=3D3D3D
%245r2.278940%40tor-nn1.netcom.ca

"It is wrong to think that a particular end justifies EVERY means. At
this time, for example, it would be wrong of the Cuban government to
send death squads after their opponents as happens in Mexico and
Colombia. Again, the actions of the Cuban government in detaining
these
so-called dissidents seem quite mild in comparison and are morally
justified under the circumstances."

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=3D3D3D3Den&lr=3D3D3D3D&ie=3D3D3D3DUTF-8&s=
elm=3D3D=3D
3D3DtxMG=3D3D
3.176443=3D3D3D
%245r2.284921%40tor-nn1.netcom.ca

Unquote.

You lie about me as you lied about Wayne Smith, Amnesty
International,
Genocide Watch, ..........

Still waiting for the "Geneva" proof comrade Dan.
That "episode" clearly exposes your lies.

As I said comrade Dan.
Every time you post that lie about me I post the truth about you.
Rem
ember the lie about "lobbying in Geneva" while I actually was on
vacation in Cuba (as the source IP address of my posts in SCC at that
time prove).
This was your false claim:
"Taking a little break from arm-twisting in Geneva, Mr. Lobbyist?"
Link:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.cuba/msg/b6375f9783e47aee?q=3D3D3=
D3=3D
Dg=3D3D
:t=3D3D3D
hl174670614d&dq=3D3D3D3D&hl=3D3D3D3Den&lr=3D3D3D3D&ie=3D3D3D3DUTF-8

Your inability to substantiate any of it is the best proof of your
lies.

Nothing more than another example of your lies and misquotes like the
ones below:

YOUR LIE about Wayne Smith
"It is clear from Smith's article here (and his website, CIP Online)
that he does, in fact, support an immediate and unconditional lifting
of your beloved embargo."
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.cuba/msg/3f1fe3a55c12d7d7?dmode=
=3D
=3D3D
=3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3Dsource&hl=3D3D3D3Den

HIS own words:

'We should reduce tensions, not aggravate it, making it clear to the
Cuban
government that we do not have hostile intentions toward them,'' Smith
said
during a 40-minute speech at a conference titled Cuba and the United
States:
Relations in Permanent Conflict, Causes, Effects and Solutions.
''I did not say lift the embargo without conditions,'' he said.
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/world/cuba/12157593.htm
You can enter after a free registration.

Permanent copy in the Cubaverdad archive:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CubaVerdad/message/16823

YOUR LIE about Amnesty International.
Another example of the same lie: putting words in people's mouth.

Do you deny that in your posts you put some snippets from the report
quoted below and on your site you also falsely claim about the same
report
that:

"Today, for the first time, Amnesty International has explicitly
denounced the US embargo on Cuba in humanitarian terms, and made clear
its support for the immediate and unconditional lifting of these cruel
sanctions"
http://members.allstream.net/~dchris/CubaFAQ215.html

Link to the "report": (the one you didn't give until I shamed you in
to it)
http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGAMR250172003?open&of=3D3D3D3DENG-CUB=


They aren't calling for an "immediate and unconditional" end to the
trade sanctions in that report, are they?
Do you deny you snipped the words "immediate and unconditional" from
these sentences in the report (THE ONLY PLACES WHERE THEY ARE USED):

"in 1.
"On the basis of the available information, therefore, Amnesty
International considers the 75 dissidents to be prisoners of
conscience(2) and calls for their immediate and unconditional
release."

In 8.1
" to immediately and unconditionally release the 15 prisoners
previously named by Amnesty International as prisoners of conscience.


" to immediately and unconditionally release anyone else who is
detained or imprisoned solely for having peacefully exercised their
rights to freedom of expression, association and assembly."

and added to those snippets your own words to create this sentence on
your lying website:

" Amnesty International has explicitly denounced the US embargo on
Cuba
in humanitarian terms, and made clear its support for the immediate
and
unconditional lifting of these cruel sanctions"

that sentence:
1. isn't in the report
2. isn't supported by the tenure and the conclusions of the report

You snipped two three words used by Amnesty to condemn the Castro
regime and abused them in a sentence to imply support for your cause:
a
BLATANT LIE.

What the report actually recommends about the "embargo" is:

"Amnesty International calls on the United States government
- to immediately suspend decisions on any measures that could toughen
the embargo.
- to review its foreign and economic policy towards Cuba, with an aim
towards ending this damaging practice.
- to place enjoyment of the full range of human rights at the
forefront of its concerns in developing new policy towards Cuba."

Clearly no immediate and unconditional end is demanded as Dan claims.
The request is for not stiffening the sanctions and to review a policy
that places "enjoyment of the full range of human rights at the
forefront of its concerns".

See:
http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGAMR250172003?open&of=3D3D3D3DENG-CUB=


Lies and more lies from comrade Dan Christensen, the resident Canadian
Stalinist propagandist of SCC.

PL
.

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