Re: Ukraine blames Karla's Red Partisan Momma for Holocaust

On Jun 29, 4:43 pm, "Ostap S. B. M. Bender Jr."
<ostap_bender_1...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Jun 29, 10:26 am, Dmitry <dmitrijsfedot...@xxxxxxxx> wrote:





Had the Marxists governments in Germany and Hungary survived, Germany
and Hungray would not only be part of the Soviet Union but most likely
the capital of the Soviet Union would have been in Berlin (as Marx and
Russian Marxists predicted), German would have been the first language
of the USSR, and all Latvian and Russian marxists would have been
living and working as government officials in Berlin.

Thus, Bolsheviks were not Russian nationalists, they were anti-
nationalsits, ultimate internationalists.

Yet vast majority of Russian population were more on a "Russaian
partriots" side and the idea of scraping Russian national identity
would have never worked.  Didn't Stalin bring Russian Orthodox Church
on to a scene in order to encourage patriotic feelings during WWII?

You are talking about 1940s, when it became obvious that the World
Revolution will never happen.

Obviously, some would have figured it out by the 40's -))

Exactly. Even in 1930s, people started to realise that the World
Revolution wasn't coming any time soon.



 Yet, I've
seen a "diafilm" produced in 1964 saying that in 20 years time (1984)
a small number of remaining "kapitalists" will squat in some small
island in the Pacific.  I also remember that the idea of World
Revolution was still promoted by Soviet media and Educational
institutions in the 70's.

No. By that time, the idea became that of "World Evolution", i.e., a
drawn-out process of getting other countries turn Marxist one country
at a time.



I am talking about 1910s and 1920s.

The idea of swapping national identities wasn't very popular,

Yes, it was. Average supporters of Bolsheviks all thought they were
making history and bringing the Communist Paradise to the entire
World. Those were very idealist times.



that's why they soon put it at the bottom of their list.

No. They soon put it at the bottom of their list because Marxists lost
everywhere else and it became apparent that USSR would remain a lonely
Marxist-ruled country in Europe for quite a few years. That's when
Bolsheviks had to put their plans for World revolution on the back-
burner and started worrying about how to keep power in the only
republics which they had under Marxist control: Russsia, Ukraine,
Belarus, Central Asia, Armenia, Georigia, Abkhazia, Azer.



 Bolsheviks had a
lot of resistance across Russian Empire and could easily fail if they
put anti-nationalism at the top of their agenda.

Bolsheviks won because the majority of the population of the Russian
Empire were more ideologists than nationalists. You come from a small
country of Latvia. And small countries have to rely on nationalism in
order to keep their small country alive. But large imperialist
countries are not too nationalist. They are driven more by ideologies
and economic greed. They revert to nationalism only in times of
trouble.

Spaniards conquered Latin America not out of nationalism but out of
greed for gold and silver and out of Catholic ideological zeal.

USA wages its wars in Iraq and elsewhere out of oil greed and the
desire to spread its ideology.

Napoleon tried to conquer entire Europe not out of nationalism but out
of personal egomania and megalomania and the deesire to spread the
French Revolution anti-monarchist ideology all over Europe.



 I
don't think Berlin could ever become a capital of USSR.

There is no doubt in my mind that if Marx/Trotsky/Lenin dream of
Europe-wide Revolution came through in the early 1920s, the capital of
this Proletariat "Soviet" Union of Europe would be in Berlin.

Has Marx ever written that Berlin is to be a capitol of the world?

Marx wrote that the World Revolution will start in a large developed
industrialised country like Germany or England. He didn't mention any
cities by name, but I would be willing to bet $100000000000 that
Moscow was not on his wish list, nor on the wish list of any other
Bolsheviks in the 1910s.



That's
what Marx/Trotsky/Lenin expected; German was the main international
language in Europe at that time;

I thought it was French?

Not in Central and Eastern Europe anymore.



and also how can you govern Western
Europe from Moscow? Too far.

Well, how can you manage Russia from Berlin?  Much farther.

If you are in charge of the entire continent of Europe, you need to
govern it from near the center of gravity in terms of population
density and industrial development.


Dmitry, yuo once wrote:


My grandfather (he was a civilian)
fled to Latvia in 1920, he never had any desire to return
back to that hell.


Why did your grandfather flee from Russia because of Bolshevism (as I
claim) or because of some kind of "Russian nationalism" that he didn't
share (as you seem to claim)?

If it was the latter, then why didn't he flee from Russia to the West
many years earlier?

And if capitalist democracy returned to Russia in, say, 1922, wouldn't
he consider returning home?

.

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