Re: Error in Wikipedia article: Faraday's law of induction

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"Szczepan Bia³ek" <sz.bialek@xxxxx> wrote in message
news:g61c6q$ils$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

"Don Kelly"
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Bull: Use the world wide definition of voltage or potential difference.
Voltage is always measured with respect to some other point.

We need absolute potential. A technical one. A neutral body is such.See
Rowland effect:
http://www.edumedia-sciences.com/a190_l2-rowland-s-disk.html

Is this the best reference that you can find ? Pathetic! As for Rowland's
experiment "The compass is deflected and the faster the spin the greater the
deflection. It appears that a magnetic field is not only set up by a current
moving through a wire but by a moving electrostatic field as well. "
It has nothing to do with the subject under consideration.
"We need absolute potential. A technical one. A neutral body is such."
consists of 3 meaningless statements for which the sum is even more
meaningless.

The term "absolute potential" is meaningless unless you have a specific
reference point. If you consider a point charge then you can calculate the
field that it produces in free space assuming that the reference or 0 point
is at infinity and from this calculate the potential at any point in space
due to that point charge and some may call it the absolute potential -that
is the potential with respect to a point at infinity. You still have a
reference point but you can't get at it. So for a number of point charges
providing you know their location and magnitude, it is possible to find an
"absolute" potential. however, in the real world we have a problem with
taking a measurement with respect to a point at infinity so we have to deal
with potential differences between points. ---
Oh, what's the use- it is physics, not hand waving and you have trouble
with that.
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So far, all that I have heard from you is a distortion of some facts and
the ignoring of other facts and the ability to weave and bobble around
and change direction (and, it appears, definitions) at will. Anything you
can't handle appears to be "details". The whole subject is, apparently,
details.

Phil wrote: "Another thing I have been wondering about is treating the
Earth as a
OPFHG."

Many people try to analyse winds and ocean currents. But they often
assume that the air is positivelly charged in electrostatic sense. They
should know that on the surface of the Earth and in the air is an excess
of electrons. The "details" are for meteorogists.

I would be happy to argue (win or lose -as it is a learning experience)
with somebody competent and knowledgable . That is not the case here.

Yes. I am not a meteorologist. In textbooks on Electrostatics I have only
on page about "Global circuit" and there is wrote that clouds are the
"high voltage generators". Of course there is all about the Earth electric
field
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You are also not a physicist or an engineer.

The clouds themselves are not the generator- it is what goes on in the
clouds that produces the conditions for charge separation just as, through
different mechanisms, there is charge separation in a battery. Now when you
consider the "global circuit" then globally, at any point in the circuit the
total current in is 0. This includes the earth. The earth is negative with
respect to the ionosphere or some other point (and positive with respect to
some other reference)- but that doesn't mean that it has an excess of
electrons. It is simply (particularly as your reference indicates it is
slightly negative- with respect to the ionosphere or the ionosphere is
slightly positive with respect to the earth- the usual way it is expressed)
the location of earth in the total circuit.
Unfortunately the global circuit is a concept that is not proven but is
likely. It may well have very little to do with thunderstorms.
http://books.google.ca/books?id=MNPPh7B3WTIC&pg=PA257&lpg=PA257&dq=global+circuit&source=web&ots=PwjIpaIjSx&sig=NLYClY6x_qwgEQ-KCYBOhBhkE4E&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result#PPP1,M1


Is a water drop charged? Since, inherently it has as many H+ as OH- ions,
it is neutral. Can it pick up or lose electrons- certainly. Put the drop in
an electric field and it will be polarized without any change in the number
of electrons or positive ions. Provide some means to extract or add
electrons and it is no longer neutral. A cat and a glass rod are both
neutral but stroke the cat with the rod and one will gain electrons from the
other- no longer neutral. Of course, the stroking involves mechanical work
as producing a potential difference involves work- just as work is done to
separate charge in a storm.

I have learned something, but not from you but in checking some references
so I have gained.

Bye and don't bother with a reply.
--

Don Kelly dhky@xxxxxxxxxxxx
remove the X to answer






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