Re: Territorial limits in the Great lakes and Caspian Sea

"Ray O'Hara" <mary.palmucci@xxxxxxx> wrote in message
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"Arved Sandstrom" <asandstrom@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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"Frogwatch" <oldfrogster@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On May 31, 9:16 am, "Arved Sandstrom" <asandst...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
"Ray O'Hara" <mary.palmu...@xxxxxxx> wrote in message

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"Frogwatch" <oldfrogs...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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Are there "International Waters" in the Great Lakes? What about
the
Caspian Sea? The Sea of Azov?

the waters of the great lakes are split between the u.s. and canada.
there
are no neutral areas. the border runs down the middle , except on
michigan
which is all in the USA

As to the others, it seems that a quick Google muddies the waters
quickly
(pun intended). The Caspian Sea is disputed, but rough sectors by all
the
countries involved do exist. It is international waters in the sense
that
a
number of countries border upon it, but not international in the sense
that
the US or South Africa or China can float ships in
there.http://www.heritage.org/Research/MiddleEast/bg1582.cfm

As for the "Sea" of Azov (big shallow lake of Azov might be a better
term)
there is no way that is international waters - it's too landlocked. In
any
case it is shallow as hell - you could not operate anything large in
there,
not when the deepest point is about 15 metres and the average depth is
a
bit
over 10 metres. It wouldn't be impossible, of course - a Newport class
LST
could access much of the sea, as could anything smaller. As you're
aware
the
sea was active enough during WW2, at least as far as smaller vessels
were
concerned.

AHS

Hudson Bay?

Many of the waters by Canada are contentious. James Bay and Hudson Bay
probably meet the test of historical waters, even if by geography they
could
be considered non-territorial waters. Hudson Strait is likely
international
waters. If Hudson Strait is considered international then so would Ungava
Bay be, most likely. The Gulf of St Lawrence is largely international
waters, although may Canadians may not see it that way.

Canada still has primary jurisdiction over these areas, because of the
EEZ
regime, exclusive fisheries, and so forth, but if the US or someone else
wanted to parade some warships in the Gulf of St Lawrence or Hudson
Strait,
they could do it. It just wouldn't make many friends. Putting warships
into
Hudson Bay would be problematic - there is no legitimate reason for
non-Canadian naval or coast guard vessels to be in there, not unless they
officially request a visit.

Let's put it this way - the Soviets in theory could sail a flotilla in
the
Gulf of Maine, legally, but both Canada and the US wouldn't like it very
much.

AHS

hudson bay and thegulf of st lawrance are canadian.

the gulf of main and massachsetts bay are u.s. waters.

The Gulf of St Lawrence is not Canadian. The Cabot Strait is 110 kilometres
wide. The channel is an international shipping route. If the USN wanted to,
they could have naval exercises there every year, and be legal.

The Gulf of Maine is not US water, except for the sense of EEZs, in which
case some of it is Canadian anyway. But the Ukrainian navy could conduct
operations there, and there's nothing the US could legally say about it.

And a Russian sub could surface 20 klicks outside Boston, and be legal doing
it.

AHS


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