Re: Thank you for your Attention and Support


piperut wrote:
Reef Fish wrote:
piperut wrote:
Reef Fish wrote:
Ray Goldenberg has ceased posting of his usual ad spam of

"Hi everyone ... I have a press release ..." for 2 days now.

During the same two days, I've heard several posters who expressed
the distaste and disdain of Ray Goldenberg's thinly disguised ads for
his Travel Agency.

For the first time in months, Ray actually responded to someone's
question, instead of "Hi everyone ... I have a press release ..."
But Ray Goldenberg fell far short of using merely his name in
reponse instead of his big bill board of his Travel Agency spam.

I'll leave everyone in peace for a couple of days to see if Ray has
changed his pattern of spamming rec.travel.cruises.

If he does return as his old self, let's ALL give him the welcome
of posting one of more of the proven SLOGANS to drive
roaches, rats, and other creatures away:

BOYCOTT CREDITS WHO RUDELY SPAM NEWSGROUPS

BOYCOTT BUSINESSES THAT RUDELY SPAM USENET GROUPS


Good night, and Good Cruising,

-- Bob,
Reef Fish,

Everyone is going to have a bit of a different opinion on if Ray's post
are on topic, or off topic for rec.travel.cruises.

That's NOT the issue. The issue is Ray's VIOLATION of the NO AD
and NO SPAM Guideline of the USENET for newsgroups, and that
rec.travel.cruises is the ONLY newsgroup blatently ignore the
violation.

That is for the
people who were regulars of this group to decide, not you.

What you said is correct! That's why I am rallying the support of
others in the newsgroup by exposing Ray's hedious act of using
rec.travel.cruises for his ADS.


Now, I have no idea where you came up with your ideas of "No
Advertising on Usenet" idea".

That idea is universally known, and universally practiced and
honored in ALL USENET newsgroups that are NOT specifically
set up for "marketing" or "sales".


There is a FAQ on how to advertise on USENET:

http://www.faqs.org/faqs/usenet/advertising/how-to/part1/

And it says, among other things what spammers should NOT do,

*> 2. *.forsale and *.marketplace newsgroups

*> There are many newsgroups directly involved in selling. You
*> can generally spot them by the word "forsale" or "marketplace"
*> in their names.

I would have no objection to Ray or anyone else going to those
groups to place their ADS, or create webpages to promote and
sell their services.

rec.travel.cruises is NOT one of the newsgroups to do it.


Reef Fish, a little research shoots you all to Dante's Inferno on
that one.

The above FAQ was one man's opinioin -- a pretty good one at that.

But what YOU, in your blinded prejudices, did not realize is that
ANYONE can create and post a FAQ, for any newsgroup or post
it anywhere in USENET!

A FAQ is never an authority or universal Guideline of Rule -- what
every group knows and practices IS.

I could write a FAQ about advertising in rec.travel.cruises, and that
would NOT violate any charter of this group OR the usenet guidelines.
But then if I quoted myself, it would hardly be fair support of my
protest of what Ray and other spammers are doing, would it?



However, that is besides the point about Ray and his posts. They are
on topic about cruising and his .sig file compiles with RFC 1855
Paragraph 2.1.1 bullet 8.

Make things easy for the recipient. Many mailers strip header
information which includes your return address. In order to ensure that
people know who you are, be sure to include a line or two at the end of
your message with contact information. You can create this file ahead
of time and add it to the end of your messages. (Some mailers do this
automatically.) In Internet parlance, this is known as a ".sig" or
"signature" file. Your .sig file takes the place of your business card.
(And you can have more than one to apply in different circumstances.)
You can also see the webpage:

http://lipas.uwasa.fi/~ts/http/signatur.html

That states:
The question of a proper signature can cause perhaps more arguments
than any other single netiquette issue (besides spam). Superficially,
and technically the main issues would seem clear:
· No more than four lines. Occasionally called the "4-line McQuary
limit".

That is a well-known guideline, NOT needed to be stated in any group
charter. That is UNIVERSAL in all USENET groups.

Nitpicking about the number of lines in a sig specifically used for
a BILLBOARD FOR AN AD is very literal and myopic and against
the spirit of the USENET charter and practice.

Try this on any thread on any cruise line:

I have press releases and brochures about this line.

Ray
Ray GoldenAd Travel Agency
800-123-999 or 123-456-7899
Fax: 876-555-5555 or 333-4444-444
http://www.goldenadtravel.com

Would that violate the rec.travel.cruises charter?

Is that an AD or what?

And when similar ADs are made 10,000 times when EVERYONE
recognizes them to be ADS, it doesn't matter HOW you try to
palm it off, using loophole arguments, they are ADS and SPAMS.


In Ray's post's he complies with the RFC, and his posts are on
topic for a newsgroup about cruises.

See the above about Ray GoldenAd.

BOYCOTT CRETINS WHO RUDELY ADVERTISES AND SPAMS
NEWSGROUPS.


Reef Fish, do you research prior to posting or you are going to look
like a fool. There are people on this newsgroup who actually spend
time doing research prior to posting something as insane as what you
posted.

Why don't you do a little research and look around USENET newsgroups
yourself!

You have a VERY SKIMPY life time posting history in newsgroups,
and most of them were NOT rec.travel.cruises -- 63 threads in your
life time.

What suddenly made you know so much about USENET rules and
guidelines?

Do a Google search using the keywords "BOYCOTT BUSINESS
THAT RUDELY ADVERTISE" or "BOYCOTT CRETINS"

and you'll find well over 1000 threads in various newsgroups
against the Ray Goldenberg type of ad and spamming practice!
or "BOYCOTT CRETINS"


Now for some reason, you have a group of people who want to take over
this newsgroup, and attempt to claim it as something you created and
control. I do not know why you are attempting to destroy
rec.travel.cruises?

roland

That's your paranoia and fantasy. Why would anyone want to take
over this newsgroup? Anyone can create a newsgroup anyday.

It's a matter of drawing attention to VIOLATORS of NO AD policies
in all usenet newsgroups!

You are a "Clueless Newbie" in USENET and in newsgroups, Piperut.

-- Bob,

Reef Fish,

Don't know how long you have been posting. Read the references. I
have been posting since 1988.

I've been posting since a year before that, and recently I estimated,
with the help from Google count that I've posted at least 100,000
posts in over 60 newsgroups and listserv LISTS.

I have been posting with the same "Reef Fish" posting name since
1992, after the posting traffic got so heavy in newsgroups and LISTS
as to clutter my email account.


Show me references about a "No Ad Policy" please. Read the charter for
rec.travel.cruises.

Read my post above that you didn't read, or read carefully enough.
Do your google search on "BOYCOTT CRETINS", and it'll show you
over 700 references in numerous newsgroups, alone the same line
as "BOYCOTT BUSINESSES THAT RUDELY ADVERTISE IN
NEWSGROUPS".


Actually, to create a newsgroup in the Big 8 takes a good deal of work.
To create an alt. group, can be done by anyone.

roland

You can create a newsgroup with what I use in groups.google.com
to READ, POST, and do everything anyone can do with Google.

-- Bob.

.

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