Re: Part of Federer's game that really needs coaching


<jason-catlin@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message news:4761fb40-a3a6-42be-89ba-4c94ed4f03ea@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On Jul 15, 6:36 pm, "bob" <r-st...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
<pedrod...@xxxxxxxx> wrote in message

news:59c7ccd7-7c79-4175-b6ae-b28dea9cd229@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx





> On Jul 15, 5:24 pm, "arnab.z@gmail" <arnab.zah...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> On Jul 16, 1:55 am, guyanper...@xxxxxxxxx wrote:

>> > On Jul 15, 3:41 pm, Whisper <beaver...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

>> > > arnab.z@gmail wrote:
>> > > > On Jul 15, 11:48 am, wkhedr <wkh...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> > > >> is his net rushing. Many times against Nadal (and others) he >> > > >> hits
>> > > >> a
>> > > >> strong forehand (or backhand) from inside the baseline (approach
>> > > >> shot), and he starts running to the net, suddenly he stops >> > > >> running
>> > > >> before reaching the service line to see what Nadal is going to >> > > >> do
>> > > >> with
>> > > >> his shot. Federer ends up dealing with a very difficult volley
>> > > >> usually
>> > > >> dipping very low, if he managed to return it, it will be an easy
>> > > >> shot
>> > > >> for his opponent to finish, if not he ends up with an error.

>> > > >> I believe Federer needs to run fast and may be jump inside the
>> > > >> service
>> > > >> box to close the net and be on the top of it, the angles will be
>> > > >> easier to handle there and any passing shot he can put his >> > > >> racquet
>> > > >> on
>> > > >> will be a clean winner. If he gets passed, so what, he needs to
>> > > >> start
>> > > >> learning to accept that.

>> > > >> His hesitation to close the net and getting caught in no man's
>> > > >> land to
>> > > >> watch his opponent's reaction is because he is afraid to be >> > > >> passed
>> > > >> and
>> > > >> this usually causes him more damage than if he closed the net.

>> > > >> He has to close the net, he will be passed, but he will learn >> > > >> how
>> > > >> to
>> > > >> guess better and where to hit the approach shot for a better
>> > > >> volley
>> > > >> follow up.

>> > > > Maybe he finds it too crazy. Just to go up there without caring
>> > > > about
>> > > > his opponent's potential passing shot. That's like a coin toss.

>> > > > There were several times when he made a nice approach and got
>> > > > himself
>> > > > properly placed at the net, and still got passed by Nadal who
>> > > > sometimes ripped a BH crosscourt winner from 10 feet behind the
>> > > > baseline. The serve and volleyer can do nothing against a good
>> > > > baseliner who can thread the needle so regularly. Federer himself
>> > > > does
>> > > > this all the time against s/v players.

>> > > If you come in on low slicing balls the s/v has advantage. Of >> > > course
>> > > if
>> > > you hit a modern type shot 20 ft behind baseline you're begging to >> > > be
>> > > passed.

>> > yes, chip and charge, not a piss topspin to the middle of the court
>> > and come in to the tee and get passed every time!! Watch Edberg or
>> > Rafter, masters of chip and charge or even Anacone!!

>> No, that theory doesn't hold in the modern game anymore, and it's
>> especially not effective in the Federer vs Nadal matchup. Nadal has
>> such great hands with these new rackets and strings that he can scoop
>> his opponent's slices of his ankles and rip winners towards any part
>> of the court. He can do it while retreating, on the run or even when
>> moving forward. This makes it extremely difficult to execute the chip
>> and charge strategy against Nadal.

>> Edberg would be obliterated by Nadal. His strategy just does not apply
>> to this era. Tennis has changed dramatically.

> Pretty much: the theory behind chip-and-charge is that a) it buys you
> time to get in position, and b) the opponent will not be able to hit
> an aggressive shot off a deep slice.

> Everyone who thinks Nadal would have any trouble *at all* hitting an
> aggressive shot off a deep slice raise their hand!

> No one?

> Not even you, Whispy?

> Yeah, I thought not.

chip and charge is the ONLY way to have a chance to beat nadal on grass. mix
up pace on the chip/charge also, some deep, some short.

do not try to rally with hard pace all match & let him get rhythm. you'll
lose.

bob-

I think it's premature to say that it's not possible to beat Nadal
without chip and charge. Djokovic played a pretty tough match against
Rafa at Queens without employing that strategy once; in fact I think
he had excellent chances to win both sets, though in the end he lost
both.

ok - djok is the 2nd physically strongest (if not best) player at the moment. the only guy who can rally with nadal and keep it close.

The problem for Novak is that he still doesn't look that
comfortable moving on grass and I don't know how quickly he can
improve in that regard. I do think that at his best Novak's flatter
ball (and better ability to take the ball early) could give him the
edge over Nadal on that surface. Really, the difference between them
at Queens was more mental than anything, in that Novak gets too easily
flustered by Rafa's dogged persistence, the pit-bullish way he just
hangs on and hangs on until the opponent gives in.
I don't know if you saw that Queens final, but I was disappointed the
way Novak mentally gave in at the end of that match, clearly flustered
because he wasn't able to close the deal in either set.

we didn't have it televised. i saw the 1st score posted, something like 3-0 djok. next score i saw was the 2 sets for nadal.

In summary, I would say Fed needs to incorporate chip and charge, but
it's not necessarily the ONLY way to beat Rafa at Wimby.

IMO, it's the only way for someone to beat nadal unless they are as strong or close. (djok being only guy in that regard). for fed, mixing it up would be only way from here on out.

bob

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: CMOS DRAM chips and static
    ... Aluminium foil is a BAD idea. ... It is NOT the current that kills CMOS, it is high VOLTAGE that punches ... chip families where tiny CURRENTS would be a hazard]. ... when discharging a significant charge. ...
    (sci.electronics.repair)
  • Re: CMOS DRAM chips and static
    ... Aluminium foil is a BAD idea. ... It is NOT the current that kills CMOS, it is high VOLTAGE that punches ... chip families where tiny CURRENTS would be a hazard]. ... when discharging a significant charge. ...
    (sci.electronics.repair)
  • And still more on the 100 meg CCD
    ... A Record-Breaking Camera Chip ... This new imaging advance packs 100 million pixels into a picture. ... The imaging chip, which is a charge-coupled device (CCD), was designed ... instantly converted to an electrical charge proportional to the ...
    (rec.photo.digital)
  • Re: Way to defeat ID cards...
    ... be quite reasonable to charge for a replacement. ... Any chip will have a statistical failure rate. ... I cannot see how the holder can be charged for replacement without ...
    (uk.politics.misc)
  • Re: CMOS DRAM chips and static
    ... but you can not 'have a significant charge' on a chip without ... There are clearly quite a few electrons in that penny, ...
    (sci.electronics.repair)